# Don't Hate Me But



## Eric Edwards (Jul 23, 2012)

What is more absurd
the name of Lucifer to
The intellectual Lucifer
and  more impious than to attribute
the devil,  that is, to personified  evil,
is the spirit  of intelligence and love  ;
it is the Paraclete, it is the Holy Spirit, while the physical
Lucifer is the great agent of universal magnetism.

so LUCIFER IS THE HOLY SPIRIT...NO AND H*** NO HE IS NOT.


WHAT is this? YOU HAVE 2 BE KIDDING ME!


Was this guy a mason?


Ã‰liphas LÃ©vi






The Secret Tradition in Freemasonry.


*February 11, 1810 - May 31, 1875*

A prolific writer on Magical Freemasonry, he has been called, "the last of the Magi." Born, Alphonse-Louis Constant, and trained for the Roman Catholic priesthood, LÃ©vi is best known for his _Doctrine of Transcendental Magic_ (1855), _Ritual of Transcendental Magic_ (1856) and _History of Magic_(1860), all written before his briefassociation with Freemasonry.

*Initiated: 14 March, 1861
Quit/dropped from rolls: August 21, 1861
Lodge Rose du Parfait Silence
Grand Orient of France, Paris.


Is grand orient a recognized lodge?*


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## Michael Hatley (Jul 23, 2012)

Did you say it was Arlington #438 you were petitioning?


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 23, 2012)

I did...

I still lack one reference anyways...
AND 438 is $500 up front I believe so I may 
wait to turn in my petition. 

Please forgive me if you find my questions insulting.

I really don't mean this in any way  rude or etc...

I am just trying to seek the truth and I many of 
my christian friends whom I have told I was joining 
have tried to talk me out of it. 

None successfully so far but there is a ton of info out 
there that can make one's head spin. 

I can't wait for the day I can wear a MM ring I just 
want to make sure there isn't something below the surface 
that God wouldn't approve of.

You have to admit though...

Pike, Hall, Levi and some others have some strange sayings.


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## calee (Jul 23, 2012)

If all you want is to wear a ring, then you are petitioning for the wrong reason.


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 23, 2012)

calee said:


> If all you want is to wear a ring, then you are petitioning for the wrong reason.


 
I can go buy a ring and learn every handshake code word and ritual online. 

I want to wear it because I want to be a member. I want to be a better man.

I want to help my community. 

I first and foremost wear the cross though inwardly.

The ring being a outward symbol I would wear with pride

once raised.


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## Michael Hatley (Jul 23, 2012)

I'll be direct.  My gut feeling is that masonry is not for you.  You are likely to be severely dissapointed in what you find behind the curtain, judging by your posts.  Not because there will be conflicts with Christianity, but because there isn't going to be the magic you expect to find.  We are simpler in many respects than a bunch of the hocus pocus stuff you've found already.  

You are likely to be uncomfortable with the obligations.  You are likely to deal with ongoing arguments from your friends that cause you to be conflicted.

Most of all I predict you will struggle with the memorization work.  Not necessarily because of mental capability, but because I predict you will lose interest in the organization during that stage and not make Fellowcraft.  It is quite a bit more time consuming than many petitioners realize.

And I think you are likely to get yourself into uncomfortable situations, often, because you are a bit tone deaf about discretion.  Your avatar is a good example of that, and so are several of your posts.

I think you would be far happier, long term, in doing work within a Church.  

I mean no disrespect to you, and I'm often wrong - but this is my honest opinion.


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## LukeD (Jul 23, 2012)

Quote:  I can go buy a ring and learn every handshake code word and ritual online.




Lol, and I can take a picture of a jet cockpit and be a fighter pilot. I have coworkers who say the same thing. There is much more to it than reading stuff online. I struggled with some stuff you mentioned as well, but not everything is meant literal. If you're going to get into esoteric studies, start with the basics. Not every definition of today meant the same thing hundreds of years ago. The mind is like a parachute, it's best used when open.


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## Spring TX MM (Jul 23, 2012)

I must agree with brother Hatley on this. I didn't catch on earlier but now the impression I get is exactly as brother Hatley stated. 

Eric, the comment you made about buying a ring online and learning the things you stated wont make you a Mason. In fact, it does just the opposite. Just my opinion but I think what you seek will not be found because you have over analyzed the whole process. I normally tell over excited initiates that George Washington didn't have the internet and that he trusted in the good men taking him by the hand and showing him the way. Researching to the degree you have and your conflicts with the misinformation and out there only help reinforce my sentiments about what brother Hately stated. I'm not trying to be the negative pill here. Just stating from experience and based on your comments.

Kyle


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 23, 2012)

Michael Hatley said:


> I'll be direct.  My gut feeling is that masonry is not for you.  You are likely to be severely dissapointed in what you find behind the curtain, judging by your posts.  Not because there will be conflicts with Christianity, but because there isn't going to be the magic you expect to find.  We are simpler in many respects than a bunch of the hocus pocus stuff you've found already.
> 
> You are likely to be uncomfortable with the obligations.  You are likely to deal with ongoing arguments from your friends that cause you to be conflicted.
> 
> ...


 
The memorization would be a breeze for me. I can remember things I hear once or read once 
for years. I don't know how I just do. I can remember my girlfriends phone numbers from 
jr. high and high school.

I remember whole chapters of books I read almost verbatim. 

I would hope your are simpler that I think. My avatar by the way was taken from 
the recent time magazine article on freemasons. I thought it looked cool.

Thank you for your opinion. You could be right but I can promise this if I am in lodge I wouldn't 
bring up issues that could cause a stir.


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 23, 2012)

Spring TX MM said:


> I must agree with brother Hatley on this. I didn't catch on earlier but now the impression I get is exactly as brother Hatley stated.
> 
> Eric, the comment you made about buying a ring online and learning the things you stated wont make you a Mason. In fact, it does just the opposite. Just my opinion but I think what you seek will not be found because you have over analyzed the whole process. I normally tell over excited initiates that George Washington didn't have the internet and that he trusted in the good men taking him by the hand and showing him the way. Researching to the degree you have and your conflicts with the misinformation and out there only help reinforce my sentiments about what brother Hately stated. I'm not trying to be the negative pill here. Just stating from experience and based on your comments.
> 
> Kyle


 
You are 100% correct just as sitting on a corner doesn't make you a stop sign.
I was simply saying why would ANYONE want to join just for a ring?

I was speaking with a friend last night and he said why would you join if you 
can't know everything to make a informed decision and anything secret can't be good. 

I said why would anyone join if you could know everything up front. lol.

He told me he considered joining but decided against it because some story his 
friend told him about his grandfather's masonic lodge having a sacrificial table in it.
:6:
I told him him that was a hilarious misinformation just like David Icke and his alien 
cult crap.


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## Michael Hatley (Jul 23, 2012)

Be careful that you don't underestimate the memorization work.  I'm saying this specifically because I have seen bright men, who were extremely fired up to be a mason run into trouble at that stage.

I sat on my own petition for over a year before submitting it.  So soul searching is by no means rare, nor am I saying research is necessarily bad.  

But the step you have to take, in my opinion, is prioritizing the personal relationships aspect.  You were urged a while back to cultivate personal relationships at your lodge.  That is where you are at, really.  You need to put the books and websites aside and go get to know the men at Arlington lodge, personally.  Pretty much all of them.  Shake hands.  Break bread.  Sit on your hands as far as the website searches and posts go, for a while.  

It is this patience and trust that is absolutely essential to making your way forward, it isn't optional.


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## Michael Hatley (Jul 23, 2012)

And brass tacks, you will find not find freemasons that worship the devil.  Period.


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## Frater Cliff Porter (Jul 23, 2012)

Alphonse Louis Constant was a Freemason. Initiated: 14 March, 1861 and was either suspended for non-payment or dropped from the roles on August 21, 1861 in Lodge Rose du Parfait Silence under the Grand Orient of France.  He was a wildly successful occultist and interesting dude.  I don't particular care for him, but he radically changed the Western magical tradition.

Albert Pike was a phenomenal Freemason.  Pike wrote weird things like 





> "Infinite and Eternal Creator, make us Your instruments to do good. Make known to all mankind that Your love suffices for all nations and that allYour children are loved by You and shall cherish each other in love. Impart unto us the power of persuasion, that our words always be kind and gentle. May they convince misled men of the excellence of the Truth. Let Your peace abide on earth!  Let the holy kingdom truly come! Let Your True Word be recovered in all things and no more hidden from humanity! Amen!"



You continue your search for religious agreement of Freemasonry and the dogma of the Craft.  You will find neither beyond men bound to one another by oath and respect.


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 23, 2012)

Frater Cliff Porter said:


> Alphonse Louis Constant was a Freemason. Initiated: 14 March, 1861 and was either suspended for non-payment or dropped from the roles on August 21, 1861 in Lodge Rose du Parfait Silence under the Grand Orient of France.  He was a wildly successful occultist and interesting dude.  I don't particular care for him, but he radically changed the Western magical tradition.
> 
> Albert Pike was a phenomenal Freemason.  Pike wrote weird things like
> 
> You continue your search for religious agreement of Freemasonry and the dogma of the Craft.  You will find neither beyond men bound to one another by oath and respect.


 
That Albert Pike quote is beautiful.


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## mattcaler (Jul 23, 2012)

I have to say that I agree with Brother Hatley on all his posts that he has made in this thread.  If you are genuine in your search then get off the internet and go have dinner with the men at Arlington Lodge every chance you get.  After spending a few months getting to know them, if they seem like a bunch of crooked, deceiving devil worshipers that are trying to lure you in to their cult then your friends at church could be right and you probably don't want anything to do with taking over the world via a Pinky and the Brain New World Order plot...do I sound absurd enough yet???  

Seriously though...you will know the character of the fraternity by the character of those men you eat dinner with.  Gage it by those relationships, not what you read on the internet or what your friend at church's cousin's uncle said.


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## Colby K (Jul 24, 2012)

mattcaler said:


> I have to say that I agree with Brother Hatley on all his posts that he has made in this thread. If you are genuine in your search then get off the internet and go have dinner with the men at Arlington Lodge every chance you get. After spending a few months getting to know them, if they seem like a bunch of crooked, deceiving devil worshipers that are trying to lure you in to their cult then your friends at church could be right and you probably don't want anything to do with taking over the world via a Pinky and the Brain New World Order plot...do I sound absurd enough yet???
> 
> Seriously though...you will know the character of the fraternity by the character of those men you eat dinner with. Gage it by those relationships, not what you read on the internet or what your friend at church's cousin's uncle said.



I could've said it better.  The only site I looked at before I petitioned / while working on my degrees was www.askafreemason.org.  nothing was spoiled for me and I had no false information.  The brothers at my lodge gave me everything I needed and never led me astray.


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## Bro_Vick (Jul 24, 2012)

The only other thing I would offer that others here haven't stated that your constant emphasis on conflict of the philosophies of Freemasonry and your religious views means it will over time become manifest destiny.  If you honestly believe that there is a core conflict or are constantly looking for devil worshipers, Wicca occultists, or some other evil force, you are going to alienate your potential brothers and cause nothing more than discord as others here have stated.

You need to recognize your attraction to the Craft, and if you believe that joining the Craft will damn your soul, then you need to not simply join.  Freemasonry is not compulsory by any means, and ones character is not directly reflected if they choose not to become a brother or accepted as such.

Sometimes we run into this with military recruits, they have a great interest in the military, but have outside factors that causes internal conflict in joining (parents, religion, criminal past, etc).  In the end they like the concept of "playing footsie" with the idea of joining the military (the attention from recruiters, friends), but won't take the final steps to finalize their commitment.  Sucking down the time of the recruiters and their staff.

Please seriously think about these things, don't come here and other places to "poke the bear", to gauge the response of whether you want to be a Freemason or not.  You have read far more than you need to have to understand if Freemasonry is right for you, and have repeatedly come here asking questions that are answered again and again.  I think you have all the information you need to understand if the Craft is the right choice for you, I hope that you can be honest with yourself and God to know whether this is the right choice.

I wish you luck in all that you do, and appreciate your contemplative nature.

S&F,
-Bro Vick


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 24, 2012)

Bro_Vick said:


> The only other thing I would offer that others here haven't stated that your constant emphasis on conflict of the philosophies of Freemasonry and your religious views means it will over time become manifest destiny.  If you honestly believe that there is a core conflict or are constantly looking for devil worshipers, Wicca occultists, or some other evil force, you are going to alienate your potential brothers and cause nothing more than discord as others here have stated.
> 
> You need to recognize your attraction to the Craft, and if you believe that joining the Craft will damn your soul, then you need to not simply join.  Freemasonry is not compulsory by any means, and ones character is not directly reflected if they choose not to become a brother or accepted as such.
> 
> ...



thank you for the sound advice


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## Tx4ever (Jul 25, 2012)

My Father was a Texas mason and this was all i needed to know to want in.


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## mattcaler (Jul 25, 2012)

Tx4ever said:


> My Father was a Texas mason and this was all i needed to know to want in.



<------------  Likes this guy :thumbup:


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## Cigarzan (Jul 25, 2012)

I've about decided to attend every stated meeting at 438 from now till,  just to be there for the ballot.


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## calee (Jul 25, 2012)

Good idea


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 25, 2012)

Cigarzan said:


> I've about decided to attend every stated meeting at 438 from now till,  just to be there for the ballot.


 
please do... Please use your gas and time 2 prove you don't want people who try to live up to their moral convictions and ask's tough questions of your fraternity. That's very integral.

Maybe your dad was a mason or something so this was a easy decision for you. 

Maybe your police captain is one...I think your a cop right?

For me nobody I know is a mason except one guy who is a 32 degree. I am a truth seeker if that makes me 
someone you don't want in your fraternity come black ball me. I wouldn't want to be a part of it anyways 
if that's the character of members.


I think your ashlar is a little rough if you can't take tough questions and inquisitive minds.

i guess you would prefer people who do no research, read no books, and blindly make decisions?

What lodge do you go to...I will just petition there and make it easier for you to black ball or 
actually meet me and see I am a good candidate.


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## Michael Hatley (Jul 25, 2012)

Eric Edwards said:


> Maybe your police captain is one...I think your a cop right?







Well played.


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 25, 2012)

Michael Hatley said:


> Well played.


 
yeah probably not...but I'm just "keepin it real" lol


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## Spring TX MM (Jul 25, 2012)

Eric Edwards said:


> What lodge do you go to...I will just petition there and make it easier for you to black ball or
> actually meet me and see I am a good candidate.



Eric, that's not the best attitude to have. All questions you have asked have been answered. Now its up to you to see the truth behind what we have said. 

A very deeply religious friend and Brother told me that when he was joining, a close friend of his who was already a Mason told him that nothing he would experience would conflict with his duty to God, laws of man or himself. This was all he needed to hear to put his fears to rest. Many good men and Masons have told you about the same thing here. Asking "difficult" questions is fine but listen to the answers. If you aren't prepared for answers, you shouldn't ask questions. Does that make sense. I'm not the most grammatically correct person. Again, not to beat a dead horse but go to lodge, meet the men there and get to know them. You'll see for yourself and then decide if its for you or not. 

S&F
Kyle


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 25, 2012)

Spring TX MM said:


> Eric, that's not the best attitude to have. All questions you have asked have been answered. Now its up to you to see the truth behind what we have said.
> 
> A very deeply religious friend and Brother told me that when he was joining, a close friend of his who was already a Mason told him that nothing he would experience would conflict with his duty to God, laws of man or himself. This was all he needed to hear to put his fears to rest. Many good men and Masons have told you about the same thing here. Asking "difficult" questions is fine but listen to the answers. If you aren't prepared for answers, you shouldn't ask questions. Does that make sense. I'm not the most grammatically correct person. Again, not to beat a dead horse but go to lodge, meet the men there and get to know them. You'll see for yourself and then decide if its for you or not.
> 
> ...


 
Well I am clearly in the minority here which usually means wisdom is with the multitude so I apologize if that's the wrong attitude.


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## daddyrich (Jul 25, 2012)

Wow. 'your ashlar is a little rough"? You've received great advice here, more than maybe some us had previous to joining ourselves. It's also important to understand that your '32 degree" friend has no more Masonic dignity than many of us lowly Master Masons, wallowing away at our 3rd.  Please stop this brow-beating, go to a Lodge dinner - they will welcome you and do their level best to answer all your questions. But you will find all this Luciferian conundrum and deep Masonic questions will be of little interest to them.  They will give you an honest lay of our landscape and after that, it's your choice. You will not get deep religio/philosophical answers here. As in any walk of life, you will have to seek, understand and live with the answers all by yourself. Good luck to you, sir.


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## cog41 (Jul 26, 2012)

Eric Edwards said:


> please do... Please use your gas and time 2 prove you don't want people who try to live up to their moral convictions and ask's tough questions of your fraternity. That's very integral.
> 
> Maybe your dad was a mason or something so this was a easy decision for you.
> 
> ...





May I make a suggestion?

Calm Down!!

I appreciate the inquisitive mind and your desire for discussion. But, if you want anybody here to talk to you further, then you probably need to rethink your reasons for being here. *Genuine *discussion of philosophy, practice, signs, symbols, history etc..?? Membership and growth as a mason practicing freemasonry??
 I agree with others here, you need to simply follow others advice and visit the brethren at the lodge and take care of business. 

"where there are many words, transgression is unavoidable, but he who restrains his lips is wise." Prov. 10:19


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## mattcaler (Jul 26, 2012)

cog41 said:


> "where there are many words, transgression is unavoidable, but he who restrains his lips is wise." Prov. 10:19



I feel that this passage of scripture pretty much sums up everything.


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## BryanMaloney (Jul 26, 2012)

A great deal of nonsense has been written about Freemasons. Thus, the only way to find out is to see for oneself, directly. Thus, go, check it out directly. God protects the faithful, right? If you really believe that God preserves, then you need fear nothing. God will preserve you in your faith and stop you should you encounter something He considers unacceptable.


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 27, 2012)

BryanMaloney said:


> A great deal of nonsense has been written about Freemasons. Thus, the only way to find out is to see for oneself, directly. Thus, go, check it out directly. God protects the faithful, right? If you really believe that God preserves, then you need fear nothing. God will preserve you in your faith and stop you should you encounter something He considers unacceptable.


 
thanks...that reply speaks more directly to me than most. I am going to visit the lodge again soon. 
I will say this though the most disgusting thing I've ever heard said was in 438 when I went. 
It was just a joke and I've told some bad ones myself but this one wasn't funny.

It was what sound does a baby make in a microwave? 
I said I don't know - the guy said me either I was to busy "masquerading <----sub word" I almost threw up.
For the most part though they seemed like good men.


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## Joseph_OConnor (Jul 27, 2012)

Eric,

I am a young, new MM and a Christian. I went to my local lodge initially, met with some folks and spent a while getting to know them--nothing but good people. Not perfect people, but then no one is, not me, not you--and we never will be.  But these folks, now my Brothers, are all in their own way actively and purposefully trying to be better men. I had some reservations before I joined but for myself, but I think it is important to make one's own mind up on something rather than rely on partial information. So throughout my process I have prayed. I asked God to let me see clearly where there might be any issues that would come between me and my faith and relationship with Him. In return, I promised Him that at any point should I be in conflict, I would walk away but I really wanted to make up my own mind on things. I can tell you for me personally, I have found nothing that in any way contradicts my beliefs or that has jeopardized my faith. In fact it has been quite the contrary. You see Masonry, despite what you might find on the internet, is not any kind of religion, cult or otherwise. It is a system of Morality to be sure, but it is in no way a means of Salvation--but it does not attempt to be. To me it is a deep personal journey into self development through knowledge of self. Combined with this there is the fraternal side of things and getting to know Brothers that have become to me some as mentors, some as fishing buddies, and many of them lifelong friends. At the drop of a dime, I know that if I needed help, they would be there to help me through any hard time or challenge, and that I can trust them with anything---a priceless thing in today's world. As far as my faith goes, it has only been an enhancement to my relationship with Him--I spend a lot more time in deep thought and consciously try to be a better man every day. Masonry as it is to me, will never be 100% what it is to you, or any other Brother out there. Secrets? You can look up many of those things or by books for that. To me the real secret is the one that only you can find for yourself. 

I don't say these things because I want you to join, or don't want you to join. I just want to tell you my experience and you will need to make the choice for yourself and draw your own conclusions. Just as in all things, we have been given the supreme gifts from God of free will and the ability to reason for ourselves. At every second of every day opportunities arise to make a choice, good or bad. We, as individuals are ultimately responsible for our own actions and choices. Instead of consulting the internet, or word of mouth, or any of these forums, I suggest you pray and the faculties of reason that has been given to you to make your own decision about Masonry. Meet with the men who will be your future Brothers. If you don't feel comfortable, don't join. If you find it conflicts with your beliefs, don't join. No one wants you to join if you don't of your own free will want to. You need to make your own mind up. No matter your choice, nothing can change the inevitable end that we all face one day. From my own faith, I believe in Salvation through Jesus Christ. While I walk this earth, I am proud to walk upright as both a Mason and a Christian--I have no conflicts.

 Whatever happens, enjoy the journey. Blessings.

Joseph O'Connor
Tanana Lodge No. 3


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## Blake Bowden (Jul 27, 2012)

Well said Brother!


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## Eric Edwards (Jul 27, 2012)

joseph_oconnor said:


> eric,
> 
> i am a young, new mm and a christian. I went to my local lodge initially, met with some folks and spent a while getting to know them--nothing but good people. Not perfect people, but then no one is, not me, not you--and we never will be.  But these folks, now my brothers, are all in their own way actively and purposefully trying to be better men. I had some reservations before i joined but for myself, but i think it is important to make one's own mind up on something rather than rely on partial information. So throughout my process i have prayed. I asked god to let me see clearly where there might be any issues that would come between me and my faith and relationship with him. In return, i promised him that at any point should i be in conflict, i would walk away but i really wanted to make up my own mind on things. I can tell you for me personally, i have found nothing that in any way contradicts my beliefs or that has jeopardized my faith. In fact it has been quite the contrary. You see masonry, despite what you might find on the internet, is not any kind of religion, cult or otherwise. It is a system of morality to be sure, but it is in no way a means of salvation--but it does not attempt to be. To me it is a deep personal journey into self development through knowledge of self. Combined with this there is the fraternal side of things and getting to know brothers that have become to me some as mentors, some as fishing buddies, and many of them lifelong friends. At the drop of a dime, i know that if i needed help, they would be there to help me through any hard time or challenge, and that i can trust them with anything---a priceless thing in today's world. As far as my faith goes, it has only been an enhancement to my relationship with him--i spend a lot more time in deep thought and consciously try to be a better man every day. Masonry as it is to me, will never be 100% what it is to you, or any other brother out there. Secrets? You can look up many of those things or by books for that. To me the real secret is the one that only you can find for yourself.
> 
> ...


 
God bless you brother well said - well said....


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## A7V (Aug 6, 2012)

Eric,

You seem to deeply want to join because you are curious but yet you are afraid of what you may find because of the things you have read on the internet.   I can assure you there are more people on the opposite side who read these things written by Freemasons who were what we call fringe freemasons (I myself am one) and think they are going to get more of that in the lodge.   They usually stop coming to meetings a few months to a year after joining when they realize that none of that stuff happens or is really ever talked about in the lodge.

I myself haven't been in a lodge for 3 years simply because the things you are afraid of finding in the lodge are not there and those things are what I seek.   I am still a mason and I still pay my dues but choose to practice the craft in other ways.   

I am an esoteric Christian, a member of the Builders of the Adytum, a member of The Fraternitas L.V.X. Occulta, or Fraternity of the Hidden Light, and former member of the Ancient Mystical Order Rosae Crucis, and have regular dealing with member of a local Golden Dawn temple, these organizations and the people who are part of them are where you go to find the information that you are afraid of finding in Freemasonry.   Yes those books and things were written by Freemasons because Freemasons come from all walks of life and hold many interests including being part of more esoteric organizatiosn but they do not represent what Freemasonry is about.

Everyone is telling you that Freemasonry is not right for you, but I disagree if the aim of Freemasonry is truly to make good men better then you certainly should become a member, but please leave your judgments at the door.


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## towerbuilder7 (Aug 7, 2012)

Well said, Brother.  The beauty of Freemasonry is that no matter what your chosen vocation, NO Man counts as MORE than the other.  Each Man is valued for his internal qualities, not the external.    Masons come from ALL walks of life, so its easy to see how so many different books on Esoteric Teachings could have been written by so many different Men.  The Brother is absolutely right, in that many of the things you are looking for may NEVER be discussed in a Lodge setting.   

I read EVERY DAY, and I am currently reading FOUR different books.  I read 10-20 pages per day, with as much free time that my career and family allow.  One of my favorite authors is Brother Manly Palmer Hall.  However, I didn't become a Mason simply to delve into the esoteric----I can do that at a library.  I joined because I made the decision to cultivate the relationships with Men whom I conversed and fellowshipped with prior to joining.  These relationships have grown into a BOND, which is all I think the Brothers above are trying to convey to you.  

Instead of making snide comments to a Brother on this Forum, who is actually a member of the Lodge you wish to join, seek him out at dinner, sit down with him, and LISTEN. You mentioned in a previous thread that you have a very good friend who is a Mason and member of this Lodge.   Sit with him and LISTEN.   Approach some of the Elder Brethren in the room, and ask them what Masonry has done for THEIR LIVES, and LISTEN. 

Masonry is NOT a religion, but it has helped enhance my FOCUS ON GOD.   I was SAVED July 29, 2008, BORN AGAIN and rededicated myself to GOD and my Church.  I was raised February 2, 2008.    The readings and lectures aren't in the Bible, but some are BIBLICALLY BASED.   You have read post after post where grown Men from EVERY CORNER of this great State and beyond have spoken with great reverence and love for Masonry.   It's not JUST because of what was IN THE BOOK; IT'S BECAUSE THEY'VE APPLIED WHAT'S IN THE BOOK TO THEIR LIVES.   IT'S ALSO BECAUSE OF THE FELLOWSHIP WITH HIS FELLOW MAN.   

I believe in a Mason being a "scientist who studies a progressive science".   The two things one should investigate thoroughly are:  The Pursuit of TRUTH, and KNOWLEDGE OF SELF.   Some of what Man can get and value in Masonry is from what is written in a book or on the NET.   BUT, you will value ALL THAT YOU GET AND LEARN MOUTH TO EAR, THROUGH YOUR MEMORY WORK.   IT ISN'T JUST THE MATERIAL THAT BUILDS YOU UP AS A MASON, though.  It is the RESPECT you will learn to give and owe to a Man who will sacrifice his TIME, simply to see to it that you learn your work the way EVERY well taught Mason should---by using his Memory.   The mentoring you will experience will forge a bond you may have for the rest of ypur life.  

You begin cultivating these relationships in your Lodge NOT by asking a lot of questions on this Forum, or antagonizing Brothers who expressed their opinion or concern about you based on what YOU wrote, Eric.   You cultivate these relationships the old fashioned way----a handshake, and a sit down.   If you HUMBLE yourself, possess genuine motives, and are a GOOD LISTENER, you will EARN another Brother's vote of confidence in your desire to become a Brother.   This is a VOLUNTEER ORGANIZATION, in that you are not compelled to join.  Only YOU will know if this is for YOU.           Good luck on whatever you decide, and stay off of the Internet for the time being.  

Bro Vincent C Jones, Sr., Bayou City Lodge 228, Prince Hall Affiliation
Free and Accepted Masonry, Houston, Texas
Most Worshipful Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Texas


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## Eric Edwards (Aug 8, 2012)

I haven't been on here in a while or done any research on masonry which has allowed my mind to cool off a bit on all the things I saw on the net. 

I may still petition but if I do it will be in Sept or Oct most likely. I have just gotten so busy lately. Thanks to all for your input even those who 

don't think I should join. I have my petition all signed and ready to go but I think I missed Aug stated meeting. I guess I will check on that.


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## Michael Hatley (Aug 8, 2012)

One last time I will advise you to get to know the folks at the lodge before submitting your petition.  I told you this a while back, twice, and others have done so since - but I don't know if it has ever sunk in that we are trying to help you.  People are more inclined to vote for a person despite something that raises their eyebrow if they know you and sense you are a good man.

And also, be advised that there will be an investigative committee assigned to you.  Be prepared to answer questions about your Christian rapping pursuit and that sort of thing.  They can google just as well as we can, enough said.

It should not be a race to deliver your petition the moment you have the signatures.  Visit the lodge.  Many times.  Shake hands with the men, get to know them all.  If you don't enjoy that process, you won't enjoy Masonry.  What you see is what you get.  

Also keep in mind that the people on this website are by and large younger and/or more forward thinking than the majority of members of any lodge, no doubt Arlington is the same.  We are telling you to respect those old men and get to know them.  That very same advice was given to me - I was told by a man in his 40s to go around, shake hands, and get to know the names of all the men in the room.  That they appreciate it.  I did that.  Most all of us here did that.  Over weeks and months.  The men on your investigative committee will be no different, and the same goes for the men who do the voting on your petition.  

Anyway, good luck Eric.


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## mattcaler (Aug 8, 2012)

Michael Hatley said:


> Be prepared to answer questions about your Christian rapping pursuit and that sort of thing.



:blink:


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## Michael Hatley (Aug 8, 2012)

Trust me, I have shown restraint....


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## towerbuilder7 (Aug 8, 2012)

Bro Hatley, I'd definitely like to say that you stayed within your Four Cardinal Virtues!   LOL     Well done, my Brother..................This journey is one that YOU have already made............This Forum allows us to simply OFFER advice; it's up to the individual to follow the advice or NOT.............Bro. Jones


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## Lauren Kandyss Coy (Aug 14, 2012)

thanks guys...


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## daddyrich (Aug 15, 2012)

Thanks for...?


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