# Millenials in Freemasonry



## Glen Cook (Jun 1, 2016)

http://www.freemasonrytoday.com/fea...-twenties-and-thirties-are-changing-the-craft


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## Companion Joe (Jun 2, 2016)

I find it interesting they start meetings at 4 p.m.

As a general rule, I balk at anything saying we need to change to suit/lure anyone. Either they want to be Masons, or they don't. Freemasonry isn't Burger King; you don't get it your way. Freemasonry is a fine meal where the chef doesn't do substitutions. If the price or methods of Freemasonry don't suit you, then you probably aren't suited for Freemasonry. There are plenty of alternative organizations. Find one that fits what you seek.


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## Ethan W (Jun 2, 2016)

As a millennial, I found this to be a very good read. I can understand where a lot of them are coming from. I'm glad to see this.

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## JJones (Jun 2, 2016)

I'm a millennial as well and I enjoyed reading this.



Companion Joe said:


> As a general rule, I balk at anything saying we need to change to suit/lure anyone.



I can't speak for all millennials, ofcourse, but I believe the trend isn't to try and 'change' Freemasonry so much as it is to improve the quality of what we have. I'm talking about changes like meals more appealing than chili dogs, officers that know their lines, well rehearsed degrees, more education at stated meetings and less reading of minutes and communications, as so forth.


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## Ethan W (Jun 2, 2016)

JJones said:


> I'm a millennial as well and I enjoyed reading this.
> 
> 
> 
> I can't speak for all millennials, ofcourse, but I believe the trend isn't to try and 'change' Freemasonry so much as it is to improve the quality of what we have. I'm talking about changes like meals more appealing than chili dogs, officers that know their lines, well rehearsed degrees, more education at stated meetings and less reading of minutes and communications, as so forth.


Well said.

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## Warrior1256 (Jun 2, 2016)

JJones said:


> I'm a millennial as well and I enjoyed reading this.
> 
> 
> 
> I can't speak for all millennials, ofcourse, but I believe the trend isn't to try and 'change' Freemasonry so much as it is to improve the quality of what we have. I'm talking about changes like meals more appealing than chili dogs, officers that know their lines, well rehearsed degrees, more education at stated meetings and less reading of minutes and communications, as so forth.


I can agree with all of this.


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## Companion Joe (Jun 3, 2016)

JJones said:


> I'm a millennial as well and I enjoyed reading this.
> 
> 
> 
> I can't speak for all millennials, ofcourse, but I believe the trend isn't to try and 'change' Freemasonry so much as it is to improve the quality of what we have. I'm talking about changes like meals more appealing than chili dogs, officers that know their lines, well rehearsed degrees, more education at stated meetings and less reading of minutes and communications, as so forth.


'
I'm all for better meals and people doing the ritual correctly. As our lodge historian and a member of the GL Education Committee, I'm all for good Masonic education. I don't mind the reading of minutes and communications I guess because I'm used to it in every body I belong to and because our stated business meetings are just that ... meetings to conduct the business of the lodge. We don't do degree work on business nights, and we don't do business on degree nights.

My earlier comment was geared more toward anyone calling for Masonry to be made "more convenient and easier for _ME_."


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## pointwithinacircle2 (Jun 3, 2016)

Companion Joe said:


> My earlier comment was geared more toward anyone calling for Masonry to be made "more convenient and easier for _ME_."


You bring up an excellent point.  One which I believe lies beneath much of the current debate over the direction that Freemasonry should take.  That point is "Should Masons serve Freemasonry or should Freemasonry serve Masons?".


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## JJones (Jun 3, 2016)

Companion Joe said:


> My earlier comment was geared more toward anyone calling for Masonry to be made "more convenient and easier for _ME_."



In that context I agree with you 100%.


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 3, 2016)

Companion Joe said:


> My earlier comment was geared more toward anyone calling for Masonry to be made "more convenient and easier for _ME_."


I agree with this too!


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## Ripcord22A (Jun 3, 2016)

pointwithinacircle2 said:


> You bring up an excellent point.  One which I believe lies beneath much of the current debate over the direction that Freemasonry should take.  That point is "Should Masons serve Freemasonry or should Freemasonry serve Masons?".


One cannot happen with out the other.

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## Companion Joe (Jun 3, 2016)

I have done dozens of investigations over the years, and I always ask the petitioner what he can contribute to Freemasonry, not what he expects to get out of it. (I do ask why they want to be a Mason, though.)


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 3, 2016)

Companion Joe said:


> I have done dozens of investigations over the years, and I always ask the petitioner what he can contribute to Freemasonry, not what he expects to get out of it. (I do ask why they want to be a Mason, though.)


Just curious, what is the most common answer?


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## Companion Joe (Jun 3, 2016)

Most of the time it's along the lines of service to an organization. I'd say close to 3/4ths of our members are veterans, so being part of something bigger than yourself seems to be important.


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## Bloke (Jun 3, 2016)

Companion Joe said:


> Most of the time it's along the lines of service to an organization...



I'd probably echo that. One of the major points I said I was curious  I was *really* worried about how much time it would take and I, for one, definitely did not want to get involved in any charitable activities - I was already engaged in a lot of that.... it's how I came to the craft....

I am a big believer in change and was  a foundation member of a lodge called "Evolution" which was focused on men under 45. At 34, I feel like one of the oldies there LOL. It was founded to "evolve" Freemasonry for younger guys with busy lives. We make it work by always trying new things, involving families when possible. To get us together, the only time which works is Sunday at 9 am. We meet 6 pm Saturdays.

The sort of article in the OP i being written all over the world at the moment. I like the points made in this one 
https://olympia1.org/2015/08/12/cultural-adaptation/ if the link goes dead, it is also here http://www.lodgedevotion.net/devotionnews/education-editorial-articles/cultural-adaptation-2015-11


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## Bloke (Jun 3, 2016)

It's long, and I've not seen this vid but know the presentation, Greg Godding has traveled around Australia presenting it at the invitation of GMs

It is a good presentation and worth watching making a good talking point for the old and young at your lodge


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## Raymond Walters (Jun 4, 2016)

Bloke said:


> It's long, and I've not seen this vid but know the presentation, Greg Godding has traveled around Australia presenting it at the invitation of GMs
> 
> It is a good presentation and worth watching making a good talking point for the old and young at your lodge





Thank you. I have shared this to a number of discussion groups on social media, and the feedback has been positive about his message in this presentation.


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## Bloke (Jun 4, 2016)

raymondswalters said:


> Thank you. I have shared this to a number of discussion groups on social media, and the feedback has been positive about his message in this presentation.


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## king82 (Jun 4, 2016)

JJones said:


> I'm a millennial as well and I enjoyed reading this.
> 
> 
> 
> I can't speak for all millennials, ofcourse, but I believe the trend isn't to try and 'change' Freemasonry so much as it is to improve the quality of what we have. I'm talking about changes like meals more appealing than chili dogs, officers that know their lines, well rehearsed degrees, more education at stated meetings and less reading of minutes and communications, as so forth.


Only thing is like to see changed is old opinions of what type of man wew should let in. And i don't mean morals I mean like if they have tattoos , earring and some lodges maybe even color. Diversity makes better lodges. Don't matter what we look like aslong as we are good masons.


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## Bloke (Jun 4, 2016)

king82 said:


> Only thing is like to see changed is old opinions of what type of man wew should let in. And i don't mean morals I mean like if they have tattoos , earring and some lodges maybe even color. Diversity makes better lodges. Don't matter what we look like aslong as we are good masons.



Barriers like that do not exist here.


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## Brother JC (Jun 5, 2016)

Nor in my lodges. I have 0 gauge plugs in my ears, had a braid down to my waist when I petitioned, and have several tattoos. A friend of mine in the Detroit area has enough ink to cover me twice and he recently finished a very successful year in the East.


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## Ripcord22A (Jun 5, 2016)

Tats dont bother me but inwould draw the line at facial tattoos...i think i would drop a black ball/cube if the petitioner had a face tattoo.  In that case it doesnt matter how upright of a man you are no one will see past that and will judge the fraternity according to ur face tat

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## Companion Joe (Jun 5, 2016)

I read something the other day where the author noted that all Millennials (with the checked shirts and bushy beards) look like deserters from a Civil War re-enactment. I immediately thought of some of our younger members and broke out laughing. 

All tats should be covered, and if you are dressed properly, they will be. The one I have is. The gauged earring things are a no-go for me. We have one member that has at least had them. I don't know if he's abandoned them or just knows not to wear them to the lodge.


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 5, 2016)

king82 said:


> Diversity makes better lodges.


Very true.


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 5, 2016)

Companion Joe said:


> The gauged earring things are a no-go for me. We have one member that has at least had them. I don't know if he's abandoned them or just knows not to wear them to the lodge.


I have ear rings but do not wear them to lodge.


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## dfreybur (Jun 6, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> Tats dont bother me but inwould draw the line at facial tattoos...



To me tattoos are permanent and therefore come with homework.  If you're going to get a tattoo do your homework and be able to explain what they are about.  My problem with facial tattoos - In tribal cultures they tend to be earned.  Badges of earned achievement and/or rank.  If you have not earned such a marking it's disrespectful to wear it.

That same principle applies to military gear "stolen honor" and to our symbols.  If you want an S&C tattooed on your body and you haven't been raised I say it needs to have "In loving memory..." on it.  There's no effective way to do that with earned facial symbols.  Who among us has a Grandpa who''s from a tribe and who earned a facial tattoo?


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## JJones (Jun 6, 2016)

I'm not a big fan of tattoos or excessive piercings myself. I've come to realize that I'm a bit conservative most of the time though.


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## Ethan W (Jun 6, 2016)

My tattoos are personal, meaningful, and important to me. They in no way should alter how someone views me. There is a time and a place for showing them. To me (as someone with tattoos) I go through every length I can to make sure that they are as covered as possible during lodge. 
I guess I feel that you have no right to judge my "ink" and I have no right to force you to see it.  

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## Glen Cook (Jun 6, 2016)

Ethan W said:


> My tattoos are personal, meaningful, and important to me. They in no way should alter how someone views me. There is a time and a place for showing them. To me (as someone with tattoos) I go through every length I can to make sure that they are as covered as possible during lodge.
> I guess I feel that you have no right to judge my "ink" and I have no right to force you to see it.
> 
> Sent from my XT1254 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app


So.....an individual has a penis tattooed on the back of his head.  May I judge that?


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## Bloke (Jun 7, 2016)

Glen Cook said:


> So.....an individual has a penis tattooed on the back of his head.  May I judge that?


Depends on if he's wearing a hat and/or how thick his hair is


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## Ethan W (Jun 7, 2016)

Glen Cook said:


> So.....an individual has a penis tattooed on the back of his head.  May I judge that?


Read the part where I say the person has no right to force them to be seen. If they can't be respectful then that bothers me more than the penis on their head.

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## Glen Cook (Jun 7, 2016)

Bloke said:


> Depends on if he's wearing a hat and/or how thick his hair is


Bald. No hat


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## Ethan W (Jun 7, 2016)

Glen Cook said:


> Bald. No hat


Then I would question his ability to represent Masonry without doing more harm then good. I would not be able to vote yes on someone who cant be respectful. 
I bet it would be one heck of a story though  

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## Glen Cook (Jun 7, 2016)

Ethan W said:


> Then I would question his ability to represent Masonry without doing more harm then good. I would not be able to vote yes on someone who cant be respectful.
> I bet it would be one heck of a story though
> 
> Sent from my XT1254 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app


I saw this in court.


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 7, 2016)

Glen Cook said:


> So.....an individual has a penis tattooed on the back of his head.  May I judge that?





Glen Cook said:


> I saw this in court.


There are some real idiots out there in the world.


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## Bill Lins (Jun 7, 2016)

Ethan W said:


> My tattoos are personal, meaningful, and important to me. They in no way should alter how someone views me.


"Should" they? Depends- see Bro. Cook's example. Do they? Being realistic, yes. Whether you like it or not, many, if not most, DO judge others on their appearance.


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 8, 2016)

Bill_Lins77488 said:


> "Should" they? Depends- see Bro. Cook's example. Do they? Being realistic, yes. Whether you like it or not, many, if not most, DO judge others on their appearance.


This is true, whether it is right or wrong to do so.


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## Ripcord22A (Jun 9, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> Tats dont bother me but inwould draw the line at facial tattoos...i think i would drop a black ball/cube if the petitioner had a face tattoo.  In that case it doesnt matter how upright of a man you are no one will see past that and will judge the fraternity according to ur face tat
> 
> Sent from my LG-H811 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app


So this just happened tonight.  We had a brother of a member of one of our sister lodges come by and request a petition.  He had a neck tattoo and a ZIA(symbol on the Nm flag) under his left eye.  I was speaking with our immediate PM after lodge and raised my concerns with him.  About 5 min ago i got a text from this PM with a link to this persons mugshot.  Looks like my concerns were well founded.

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## Ethan W (Jun 9, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> So this just happened tonight.  We had a brother of a member of one of our sister lodges come by and request a petition.  He had a neck tattoo and a ZIA(symbol on the Nm flag) under his left eye.  I was speaking with our immediate PM after lodge and raised my concerns with him.  About 5 min ago i got a text from this PM with a link to this persons mugshot.  Looks like my concerns were well founded.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H811 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app


In modern society a facial tattoo just seems to be a severe lack of common sense, judgement, and stupidity. And that is coming from someone who likes tattoos. 

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## Warrior1256 (Jun 9, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> So this just happened tonight.  We had a brother of a member of one of our sister lodges come by and request a petition.  He had a neck tattoo and a ZIA(symbol on the Nm flag) under his left eye.  I was speaking with our immediate PM after lodge and raised my concerns with him.  About 5 min ago i got a text from this PM with a link to this persons mugshot.  Looks like my concerns were well founded.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H811 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app


Very good!


Ethan W said:


> In modern society a facial tattoo just seems to be a severe lack of common sense, judgement, and stupidity. And that is coming from someone who likes tattoos.
> 
> Sent from my XT1254 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app


Totally agree!


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## dfreybur (Jun 9, 2016)

Ethan W said:


> In modern society a facial tattoo just seems to be a severe lack of common sense, judgement, and stupidity. And that is coming from someone who likes tattoos



Tattoos are permanent markings on our bodies.  As such I'm fussy about people doing their homework on any tattoo they get.

In those tribal societies that do facial tattoos, those markings are *earned*.  It would be like having an S&C or a military symbol on their face.  Whatever it is that someone wants to put on their face, I want to know how it was earned and what it means.  Some tribal symbol that means you killed a man in combat - Do you really think you earned that?

Tattoos on other parts of the body are supposed to be deeply meaningful to the person who has them.  Tattoos on the face are supposed to be earned.  This is why I don't mind tattoos but mostly draw the line at tattoos on the face.  It's at best willfully ignorant and generally profoundly disrespectful to the source of the image.


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 10, 2016)

dfreybur said:


> Tattoos on the face are supposed to be earned. This is why I don't mind tattoos but mostly draw the line at tattoos on the face. It's at best willfully ignorant and generally profoundly disrespectful to the source of the image.


Good point, I never considered it this way.


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## Manderthal (Jun 12, 2016)

As much as I like to see the effort of new masons who want to work at making blue lodge their own I do get mighty annoyed at new masons who want to change the lodge without spending the time getting to know the existing lodge first.
Masonry is in a revival and we DO have the luxury of being choosy. Accept the men who you would open your home to. Let the others join some other club. It's like hiring - By being choosy you may miss out on a good man but you won't accept a bad man. It's hard to get rid of a bad fit. Don't let them in simply because you need another dues payer.


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## Warrior1256 (Jun 12, 2016)

Manderthal said:


> Masonry is in a revival and we DO have the luxury of being choosy. Accept the men who you would open your home to. Let the others join some other club. It's like hiring - By being choosy you may miss out on a good man but you won't accept a bad man. It's hard to get rid of a bad fit. Don't let them in simply because you need another dues payer.


Agreed!


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