# If attempting to heal from PHA, whose recommended PHO or JGJ??



## kwhtraveler41 (Dec 1, 2021)

Before the replies start coming in believe me when I tell you, it took years of my own study and efforts to know event what I know now and when I was raised in 2009, I had no clue about the 
various sects and letters, charters, who was considered bogus who wasn't.   What I've come up with throughout the years is that if the UGLE never actually recognized most PHA lodges then it's the same game that PHA plays
with others that practice masonry under different structures. In my mind, that never changed what organically masonry was supposed to be.  So I am not seeking to heal over because of any of that, and I do not care who is PHA in here and well equipped for debate and argument.  I'm here to find out why we don't practice masonry the way we are supposed to but our claim to fame is Prince Hall putting it down to establish blacks in masonry and get
that recognition. It does boil down to the little things!! First of all, I didn't understand back when I was first raised how important dues were to an organization. I get it now but if my opinion is if you are going to suspend a bro based on dues, blackball them because they are getting nothing from your lodge perhaps it falls to the leadership of that lodge to square that away.  I wouldn't collect a dusty dime in a beat-up building Bro!!!!! That's just me.....
    If I know a Bro has called on me in distress and I ignored that.....How can I look that Bro in the eye?? Do we not have the same OB!!  Some of the most toxic dudes I met have been in the craft and it started with meeting the military ones.  I know what you're thinking why did you become one?  Because I did some study!!  If becoming a Freemason was based solely on the social apparatus I could have found that times 10 at just about any church.
     What I seek from the posting is just good advice from non- PHA Bros.  PHA Bros, I've heard all the schism I care to hear, I don't give a damn about whether I am considered a clandestine, technically so was everyone not recognized by the UGLE.


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## kwhtraveler41 (Dec 1, 2021)

So you can't edit or make corrections to those posts on here?


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## kwhtraveler41 (Dec 1, 2021)

A few typos I wanted to correct but I think the main point will recieve!!


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## Glen Cook (Dec 2, 2021)

Yes, you can edit. Look at the bottom of the post.  I would encourage you to do so. It is hard to decipher what you are trying to say. I think the following points are responsive:

UGLE is not the arbiter of regularity.

Recognition is not the same as regularity.

UGLE does consider PHA regular. http://bessel.org/masrec/phaugle.htm

PHA is considered regular by the CGMNA.. http://www.recognitioncommission.org/publish/2006/03/28/2006-commission-report/index.html

 No, we don’t all have the same obligation.

There are bad people in every obedience.


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## Abdurrahim muhammad (Dec 3, 2021)

Brother I understand , I never even heard of a iUGLE until I became a master mason. Then I found out my grand lodge is not recognised by ugle then I hear my grand lodge is part of saglia whatever that is . My research on becoming a mason was didn’t include all of that. I thought masons was a brotherhood worldwide and it’s not you have to be affiliated with Ugle in order to be recognised . I petitioned with a brother   To become initiated and now I’m penalised . This is crazy . But I understand you


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## Glen Cook (Dec 3, 2021)

A GL doesn’t have to be affiliated with UGLE to be recognized..  

What is the name your Grand Lodge?


Abdurrahim muhammad said:


> Brother I understand , I never even heard of a iUGLE until I became a master mason. Then I found out my grand lodge is not recognised by ugle then I hear my grand lodge is part of saglia whatever that is . My research on becoming a mason was didn’t include all of that. I thought masons was a brotherhood worldwide and it’s not you have to be affiliated with Ugle in order to be recognised . I petitioned with a brother   To become initiated and now I’m penalised . This is crazy . But I understand you


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## Abdurrahim muhammad (Dec 3, 2021)

MW Abraham grand lodge of texas


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## Glen Cook (Dec 3, 2021)

Abdurrahim muhammad said:


> MW Abraham grand lodge of texas


Thank you. Yes, that group is irregular. My recommendation would be you heal to PHA Texas. I can help you with contacts if you wish.


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## Abdurrahim muhammad (Dec 4, 2021)

Glen Cook said:


> Thank you. Yes, that group is irregular. My recommendation would be you heal to PHA Texas. I can help you with contacts if you wish
> 
> 
> Glen Cook said:
> ...


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## Glen Cook (Dec 4, 2021)

Not legitimate.
Of the grand lodges you have mentioned, only PHA is legitimate. Certainly, you can seek to join GL of Texas as well.


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## Bro. David F. Hill (Dec 8, 2021)

As was stated above there are only two recognized Grand Bodies.  There are more African American Bogus Masonic Organizations in the United States than there are Legitimate Grand Lodges around the World. ‍ Why, because the organization was started by or has lineage to an expelled mason or an individual with no masonic ties whatsoever (see the link below).






						About
					






					thephylaxis.org
				








						Bogus Masonic Organizations
					






					thephylaxis.org


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## Abdurrahim muhammad (Dec 8, 2021)

SMH. The grand lodge I belong too  just celebrated 44 years of establishment . From my understanding there is no hierarchy in freemasonry each jurisdiction functions independent of the other . What makes me a master mason? No where in any ritual I seen that my grand lodge makes me a master mason. Ugle is said to be the first lodge established. But that doesn’t make them the the ruler or governor of all the lodges . What is a lodge ? A governing body of masons duly assembled with a VSL, the greater lights and a charter or warrant enabling them to work. We have that. So with that being said  I serve my worshipful master with freedom, fervency , and zeal. And  my grandmaster . If you have a issue with my lodge or it’s establishment this platform is not where you should dispute that but call grandmaster and my worshipful master and have that conversation with them.


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## Glen Cook (Dec 8, 2021)

Abdurrahim muhammad said:


> SMH. The grand lodge I belong too  just celebrated 44 years of establishment . From my understanding there is no hierarchy in freemasonry each jurisdiction functions independent of the other . What makes me a master mason? No where in any ritual I seen that my grand lodge makes me a master mason. Ugle is said to be the first lodge established. But that doesn’t make them the the ruler or governor of all the lodges . What is a lodge ? A governing body of masons duly assembled with a VSL, the greater lights and a charter or warrant enabling them to work. We have that. So with that being said  I serve my worshipful master with freedom, fervency , and zeal. And  my grandmaster . If you have a issue with my lodge or it’s establishment this platform is not where you should dispute that but call grandmaster and my worshipful master and have that conversation with them.


The length of time the group has existed is irrelevant to regularity.  There are co-ed GLs older than that.

Obligations differ. Did yours mention clandestine GLs?  That refers to your group.

UGLE was the first - grand - lodge. No one said it was the ruler or governor of all lodges. It is not.

The charter has to come from a legitimate masonic authority. Yours does not.

Yes, this is the appropriate place to discuss regularity.

We have no need to call your leaders.  They are clandestine masons. Further, in regular freemasonry that would be a breach of masonic protocol for most of those here.

No need to take our word.  Come visit this group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/800031203385032/?ref=share


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## MarkR (Dec 9, 2021)

My ritual mentions "a just and *lawfully constituted *lodge."


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## Winter (Dec 9, 2021)

Finding out you joined a clandestine organization and then doubling down on its legitimacy. You will likely not find many supporters in a forum mostly full of regular mainstream and PHA Brothers. Not saying you won't find any sympathetic ears. We're not trying to be rude, but your arguments will not go far here. We've heard them all before. 

Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk


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