# Go ahead and rant....we need the release



## Star Mztyk (Jul 1, 2012)

Sometimes I have seen Brothers absolutely lose it over something that I would consider totally trivial. We psychologically have a tendensity to take sides and forget our Cardinal Virtues. The Justice part reminds me of being admonished not to err and being just and upright in our several stations......we just forget to square those actions when lost in the heat of the moment. This is when we test the tolerance of others.
   I have a rant I need to get off my chest and  and I have the fortitude to reveal this is no secret to many of us. Often, when I go to a Forum and Exam the CoW has decided to change the choreography again and again....turn this way...no turn that way...go back to how you did it before. Hold hands ....dont hold hands. Dont ever believe that someone is not always going to try to change the ritual. I have heard that the CoW have even had un-Masonic episodes of lack of who can best work and best agree. 

   I created this thread so you can vent....no one has to argue with you. You have the Right to your opinion and I neither expect nor desire you to get your panties in a knot...or to try to untie my underwear.  Whats your beef?


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## Michael Hatley (Jul 1, 2012)

I just wish to hell more, ANY past masters would voice their opinions at lodge!  You can't get any of them to ever speak up and take part in the discussions.  I just don't understand why they seem so shy.

Plus they never have any input about the food, or how money is spent.  You'd think after all these years they would have some kind of view formed on that sort of thing.

It would also be comforting if the past masters would from time to time disagree with each other on something, anything.  They all seem to be in lockstep.  So annoying.  It means that only the young guys are the only ones that ever argue about anything, and that gets so boring.

One other thing - it would be so helpful if once in a while they would look for something that the line officers are doing wrong.  Scour the minutes of the meetings they aren't attending if they have to, but give the young guys some good, critical feedback - and do it during a stated meeting in granular detail, at length.  I know I'm not the only one who would prefer more lengthy meetings focused on minutae.

:thumbup:


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## Bro. Stewart P.M. (Jul 1, 2012)

Michael Hatley said:


> I just wish to hell more, ANY past masters would voice their opinions at lodge!  You can't get any of them to ever speak up and take part in the discussions.  I just don't understand why they seem so shy.
> 
> Plus they never have any input about the food, or how money is spent.  You'd think after all these years they would have some kind of view formed on that sort of thing.
> 
> ...



Wow! Well, maybe I should send you half of our past masters... We have none of the issues that you have at your Lodge!

I guess that I am lucky!


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## Michael Hatley (Jul 1, 2012)

I would never deprive such a good and worthy Brother!!


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## Bro. Stewart P.M. (Jul 1, 2012)

Okay here is mine!

I wish that new Past Masters would not cut-tail and run after installation. It seems that once you have exited the East, you are excused from ever returning... 


The Past Master's that I speak of in my earlier post (Bro. Hatley), are the ones that went through the chairs 20 or more years ago. Yes, and they offer unlimited sources of opinions and advice. We are lucky enough to have 15% or more of our members turn out at our Stated Meetings, we have 10 A-Certificate holders who are active in Lodge and floor school, and are blessesd with 2 District Instructors and one current Grand Tiler. I can only assume that we are able to accomplish all of this because of our meeting frequency... some 104 regular meetings per year, plus special events.


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## Benton (Jul 1, 2012)

Bro. Stewart said:


> Okay here is mine!
> 
> I wish that new Past Masters would not cut-tail and run after installation. It seems that once you have exited the East, you are excused from ever returning...
> 
> ...


 

I've often wondered if more regular meetings wouldn't increase attendance. In my college fraternity, we met weekly for a business meeting. Yes, every single Friday. And we did the same things we do in lodge that people complain about; bills, minutes, etc. But because we did it more often, it often took less time. Plus, getting to see everyone on a regular basis made us all very close to one another. I'd say we usually had about 85% in attendance at each meeting, and I think the regularity with which we met had something to do with it. Course, we were all youngin's. I'm not sure the same would hold true for older men.


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## Star Mztyk (Jul 1, 2012)

Bro. Stewart said:


> I wish that new Past Masters would not cut-tail and run after installation. It seems that once you have exited the East, you are excused from ever returning...



   In our lodge, the newest PM always becomes a Steward again........he has just become qualified to Truly serve that office. Also, I bet we have not had 10 A certificate holders in our 157 year history.


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## Star Mztyk (Jul 3, 2012)

....I counted the A Cert.s  last night.... 12


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## Bro. Stewart P.M. (Jul 3, 2012)

Star Mztyk said:


> ....I counted the A Cert.s  last night.... 12



That is awesome!


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## Blake Bowden (Jul 4, 2012)

I wish we would sell our Grand Lodge Facility in Waco
I wish more PM's would attend our meetings
I wish more EA's would finish their work
I wish I didn't go blank at times during ritual work, especially in the East
I wish there were less politicking in Grand Lodge
I wish Past Grandmaster would retire from any further Masonic duties at GL


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## JJones (Jul 4, 2012)

> I wish we would sell our Grand Lodge Facility in Waco



I agree with much of what I've read, but this especially.


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## bkoerner (Jul 15, 2012)

Lol


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## Tinman392 (Jul 15, 2012)

I wish more members would show at stated meetings.  
I wish more people would show up to weekly floor school
I wish the brothers who seem to enjoy pouncing on other brothers for saying an improper word would help instead of belittle.  My opinion only.
I wish the stated meetings would be more than just the usual business.
I love my lodge but these are issues I see at a lot of different lodges I have been to.


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## Brent Heilman (Jul 16, 2012)

Tinman392 said:


> I wish more members would show at stated meetings.
> I wish more people would show up to weekly floor school
> I wish the brothers who seem to enjoy pouncing on other brothers for saying an improper word would help instead of belittle.  My opinion only.
> I wish the stated meetings would be more than just the usual business.
> I love my lodge but these are issues I see at a lot of different lodges I have been to.


 
Those are some of my thoughts also. I get tired of hearing people complain about how long the meetings take. If you don't want to be there don't show up. Also, if you don't like being corrected on occasion show up to a practice. That's what it is for. To go along with that, if someone corrects you don't get your panties in a wad over it either. Accept the correction, remember it, and move on.


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## Star Mztyk (Jul 16, 2012)

There is a fine art in the process of correcting people in what the GLoT calls the esoteric work. I have one EA student about to turn in his work...and he knows the right liturgy....but I will not verbally correct him while he does this in an open EA lodge. I do however have certain body language from the most subtle Huh? of an eyebrow....to a full body WTF?  lol 

It is my personal opinion that no correcting should be done verbally in an open lodge. However, my WM does watch me to see me go ahead into a hand move when he forgets the S,P and gavel come next. As a body, the whole lodge works in unison and just like learning anything as an individual there is a contant learning process of the body as a body ....even when dually assembled.


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## Brent Heilman (Jul 16, 2012)

I guess I should have stated that in practice the corrections should be offered. In a stated meeting it would depend on how large an error it was. If during a degree never.


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## Ashlar (Sep 27, 2012)

Michael Hatley said:


> I just wish to hell more, ANY past masters would voice their opinions at lodge!  You can't get any of them to ever speak up and take part in the discussions.  I just don't understand why they seem so shy.
> 
> Plus they never have any input about the food, or how money is spent.  You'd think after all these years they would have some kind of view formed on that sort of thing.
> 
> ...



As Bro. Stewart stated , I would be more than happy to send you a few of ours (and a few from a few sister lodges) . 

I wish some , most , sometimes all Past Masters would shut the hell up and allow the Master and his officers run their lodge . I wish they would quit sitting on the sidelines saying "That is not how we did it !" , " We want something else for dinner !" , "Dinner was started two minutes late !" , "You left the word THE out that lecture !" , "I don't care what the constitution says , IT'S WRONG !" , or The constitution says this or that when it does not but will argue with you anyway even after you directly read it to them .

I wish Past Masters would stop thinking they run the lodge from the sidelines . If they disagree with the Master , then go off to the side away from the Craft and talk about it , Do not yell out in the middle of a lodge meeting unless it is a decision that would be a by-laws/constitution violation , then do it in a respectful manner . 

I wish Past Masters would stop holding their private conversations on the sidelines during degree work . I wish Past Masters would stop correcting the officers in the middle of degree work in front of a candidate . If the officers make a mistake , LET IT GO and correct them in private after the degree . The candidate will more than likely never know .

I hate it when you lose your place during degree work and instead of your prompter , you have 3 or more Past Masters yelling out the next word , and none of them are correct .

If a Past Master sees things that may be incorrect , then by all means , bring it to the Master's attention . But when a new Master is trying new things to make lodge interesting and get it out of a rut and correcting years of mistakes because "it has always been done this way" then Past Masters need to keep their comments to themselves .

As a Past Master myself , I do things in private . I correct the sitting Master in private . I do not correct officers or the Master in the middle of degree work . I do not think I run the lodge (I had my time in the Oriental Chair and I am more than happy to let go of the reins) . I keep my mouth shut unless I see something that needs to be corrected or if I am asked for my input . And it is according to the degree of the mistake as to when and where I will correct the Master / officer / members .

As far as correcting mistakes , as others have stated , in a stated meeting except the correction and move on . But there is a time and place to be correcting the officers/lecturer . In the middle of a degree is not the time and place (unless they bring a candidate in for a FC/MM degree without his apron or the such) and if one MUST correct a ritualist , DO IT QUIETLY by whispering it in his ear , not from across the lodge room (unless you are the designated prompter)  . As I stated above , the candidate will more than likely never know . I have one person prompting me , and he is to only prompt me when I give him a nod . If I lose my place or draw a blank , I am very good at improvising until I get the train back on the tracks .  During my EA degree , it was the sitting Master's first time conferring the degree , he was nervous and made many mistakes . I could tell he was nervous but I would have never known he was making mistakes if not for the gaggle of Past Masters in the corner constantly correcting him . It really took away from the experience for me .


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## dreamer (Sep 27, 2012)

I wish membership was contingent upon showing up (if able to do so)  to a stated a few times a year.
I wish dues fit the times.
I wish we were more friendly to those  that comes through the doors for the first time.
I wish more participation with ritual from the Brethren.


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