# SC/GA PHA and UGLE



## Seeking4Life (Sep 27, 2017)

Good Evening,

So reading some of the other threads I was lead to the UGLE website in order to find "regularity", "Irregularity."
My question is, why is it that the MWPHGL SC/GA not listed when so many others are?


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## Ripcord22A (Sep 27, 2017)

Cause they haven't asked


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## Glen Cook (Sep 27, 2017)

In this specific case, they are not in amity with the state GL counterpart.  Others, such as OK PHA, have not requested recognition.


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## Seeking4Life (Sep 28, 2017)

Glen Cook said:


> In this specific case, they are not in amity with the state GL counterpart.  Others, such as OK PHA, have not requested recognition.



Thanks!
Okay so in the thread that I saw a person said to look  on the UGLE website to find "regular" gl's/mwphgl's of state. And that if any aren't listed they are clandestine.  
So I guess my next question/s (haha) is...are the gl's that are not listed on the UGLE considered irregular/ Clandestine ? 
If a mwphgl and state/mainstream  gl don't have amity with each other does that exclude the mwphgl from being listed on the site (even though pha has history tied to England ?)
Sorry for the many questions. Eager, hungry, and patiently waiting to learn.


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## Glen Cook (Sep 28, 2017)

Seeking4Life said:


> Thanks!
> Okay so in the thread that I saw a person said to look  on the UGLE website to find "regular" gl's/mwphgl's of state. And that if any aren't listed they are clandestine.
> So I guess my next question/s (haha) is...are the gl's that are not listed on the UGLE considered irregular/ Clandestine ?
> If a mwphgl and state/mainstream  gl don't have amity with each other does that exclude the mwphgl from being listed on the site (even though pha has history tied to England ?)
> Sorry for the many questions. Eager, hungry, and patiently waiting to learn.


Unless you are a UGLE member, the UGLE website is only a starting place. Your GL determines regularity for you. UGLE likely doesn’t recognize the same Italian GL as your GL. Your GL may well recognize a different Paraguayan GL than FL.  

PHA GA and SC are regular, but not recognized by any State GL.  

No, UGLE doesn’t recognize PHA unless in amity with the SGL counterpart.


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## MRichard (Sep 28, 2017)

Glen Cook said:


> In this specific case, they are not in amity with the state GL counterpart.  Others, such as OK PHA, have not requested recognition.



Oklahoma PHA is probably the only PHA grand lodge that I am aware of with full recognition and visitation that hasn't asked. Are you aware of any others Brother Cook?


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## Glen Cook (Sep 28, 2017)

MRichard said:


> Oklahoma PHA is probably the only PHA grand lodge that I am aware of with full recognition and visitation that hasn't asked. Are you aware of any others Brother Cook?


For UGLE, I’m only aware of OK.  I should think that KY, as they have an agreement to share jurisdiction, could do so, even though there are limits on jurisdiction.


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## MRichard (Sep 29, 2017)

Glen Cook said:


> For UGLE, I’m only aware of OK.  I should think that KY, as they have an agreement to share jurisdiction, could do so, even though there are limits on jurisdiction.



So Kentucky has recognition without visitation between the state grand lodge and PHA?


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## Warrior1256 (Sep 29, 2017)

MRichard said:


> So Kentucky has recognition without visitation between the state grand lodge and PHA?


It used to be this way. However, as of last year we now have visitation rights.


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## MRichard (Sep 29, 2017)

Warrior1256 said:


> It used to be this way. However, as of last year we now have visitation rights.



I wonder whether the Kentucky PHA grand lodge has requested recognition from the UGLE. Should be just a formality now. Then again, they didn't need for visitation to be approved first since there was already recognition without visitation.


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## Dontrell Stroman (Sep 30, 2017)

Since PHGL of KY and the GL of KY now have recognition and visitation; what would happen of the GL of KY pulled back recognition and the UGLE had recognized them. Would the UGLE pull recognition too ?

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## MarkR (Oct 1, 2017)

Travelling Man91 said:


> Since PHGL of KY and the GL of KY now have recognition and visitation; what would happen of the GL of KY pulled back recognition and the UGLE had recognized them. Would the UGLE pull recognition too ?
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS997 using My Freemasonry mobile app


Since I don't know of that ever happening, we'd be purely speculating.  So, my speculation is that UGLE would decide based on the reason for GLoKY pulling recognition.  If they agreed with the reason, they'd do so as well, but I don't think they'd strictly go along with KY regardless of the reason.


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## MRichard (Oct 1, 2017)

Travelling Man91 said:


> Since PHGL of KY and the GL of KY now have recognition and visitation; what would happen of the GL of KY pulled back recognition and the UGLE had recognized them. Would the UGLE pull recognition too ?
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS997 using My Freemasonry mobile app



Since they haven't pulled recognition of either Georgia or Tennessee state grand lodges yet, they will likely stay out of it unless it was something nuclear.


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## Warrior1256 (Oct 1, 2017)

Travelling Man91 said:


> Since PHGL of KY and the GL of KY now have recognition and visitation; what would happen of the GL of KY pulled back recognition and the UGLE had recognized them. Would the UGLE pull recognition too ?


This is beyond my pay grade, lol.


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## TonyT2020 (Mar 19, 2020)

Glen Cook said:


> For UGLE, I’m only aware of OK.  I should think that KY, as they have an agreement to share jurisdiction, could do so, even though there are limits on jurisdiction.


Greetings Bro Mark and thank you for the data. Where would the MWPHGL of Maryland and Louisiana stand? I am interested since I am tracking that in Maryland, MWPHGL and SGL are in recognition of each other; while in Louisiana the MWPHGL of Louisiana and SGL are not in recognition of each other.

Your reply and take is very appreciated.


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## TonyT2020 (Mar 19, 2020)

TonyT2020 said:


> Greetings Bro Mark and thank you for the data. Where would the MWPHGL of Maryland and Louisiana stand? I am interested since I am tracking that in Maryland, MWPHGL and SGL are in recognition of each other; while in Louisiana the MWPHGL of Louisiana and SGL are not in recognition of each other.
> 
> Your reply and take is very appreciated.


Apologies, Bro Cook was the intended reply~


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## Bro.Chris (May 31, 2020)

TonyT2020 said:


> Apologies, Bro Cook was the intended reply~



Interesting 


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## Mike Martin (Jun 10, 2020)

TonyT2020 said:


> Greetings Bro Mark and thank you for the data. Where would the MWPHGL of Maryland and Louisiana stand? I am interested since I am tracking that in Maryland, MWPHGL and SGL are in recognition of each other; while in Louisiana the MWPHGL of Louisiana and SGL are not in recognition of each other.



The UGLE extends recognition to the Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Maryland but not to Louisiana. This is most likely due to the "exclusive territorial jurisdiction" requirement of recognition from the Home Grand Lodges.


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