# Knights Templar



## Red942 (Apr 20, 2014)

hello, I want to ask some questions about the relation between Knights Templar and Masons.
Freemasonry uses KT symbols and rituals, are the masons the same as the KT ?

I want to become a Knight Templar, should I join freemasonry ?

I saw http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...nic_appendant_bodies_in_England_and_Wales.jpg

IN it there is a Knight Templar rank... Is this for Christians only ?


Thanks


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## BryanMaloney (Apr 20, 2014)

The Knights Templar are extinct. They were eliminated by a King of France who owed them a lot of money, in collusion with a corrupt Pope. There are various fairy tales about how they somehow secretly survived in various guises, including the Freemasons. The Masonic organization that includes a degree with the Templar name is commemorative, not a successor. There are no Templars. If there were, you'd probably have to be Roman Catholic to be inducted, like for the Sovereign Order of Malta.


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## Red942 (Apr 20, 2014)

Thank you for your reply my friend.
I am Catholic, that's why I am seeking to be a knight Templar.
And I know the history of the KT that's why I am seeking to become one.
Plus I only mentioned this because most of masonic symbols are from KT.
The red cross, etc...

And according to the picture I put, it's Freemasons.
And there ranks that shows Knights Templar should have christian faith, and Knights of Malta like you mentioned and KT priests....
And if you look to the KT rank you will see the picture of 2 men on one horse, which symbolise the poverty of KT.
It's their symbol...

Regards


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## j_gimpy (Apr 20, 2014)

Red, there are no modern Knights Templar groups that have connections to the medieval monastic knights. The Masonic Knights Templar take the name, symbols, and teaching of the monastic order in order to confer moral lessons; the connection is a superficial and artificial one. I'm sorry to say, but you won't find any true, modern descendants to the Knights Templar. 

Likewise, you should also know that the Catholic Church (unfortunately) does not allow its members to become Freemasons, under the pain of mortal sin. If you're interested in Catholic fraternalism you might want to look into the Knights of Columbus, though Freemasonry does not ban Catholics, so you're still welcome to apply for membership if it's something you think you might want to get involved in.  



Junior Steward
Phoenix Lodge #154
Sumner, WA


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## Bro. Stewart P.M. (Apr 20, 2014)

j_gimpy said:


> Likewise, you should also know that the Catholic Church (unfortunately) does not allow its members to become Freemasons,..



This is not an entirely true statement.

The "church" itself does not specifically have a permanent stance on the Fraternity or Freemasonry. Rulings either pro or con are constantly reversed or enacted throughout time, each Pontiff seems to have his own personal view of things as with everything else. The decision is left to the local Diocese to decide or enforce, and because of that... varies from district to district inconsistently.


For example the Fort Worth and Dallas Diocese have strikingly different perspectives about the fraternity.


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## BryanMaloney (Apr 20, 2014)

Red942 said:


> Thank you for your reply my friend.
> I am Catholic, that's why I am seeking to be a knight Templar.
> And I know the history of the KT that's why I am seeking to become one.
> Plus I only mentioned this because most of masonic symbols are from KT.
> ...



There is no legal restriction on using any of the symbols of the Templars by anyone. Anybody can do it. The various ranks within the Masonic organization are not ordained clergy. The "Knights of Malta" within Freemasonry are not legally members of the Sovereign Military Order of Malta (the real "Knights of Malta") or any of the "Johanniter Alliance" orders, either. It doesn't help that the official site for the Grand Encampment (USA) obscures things by claiming they were founded in the 11th century and claims the original Templars were a "Christian-oriented fraternal organization", when the real Knights Templar were an explicitly Roman Catholic military order dedicated to conquering the Levant, and claiming on another page that they were not founded in the 11th century as the original Templars.


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## RyanC (Apr 20, 2014)

j_gimpy said:


> Likewise, you should also know that the Catholic Church (unfortunately) does not allow its members to become Freemasons, under the pain of mortal sin. If you're interested in Catholic fraternalism you might want to look into the Knights of Columbus, though Freemasonry does not ban Catholics, so you're still welcome to apply for membership if it's something you think you might want to get involved in.



Many Catholics are Mason, and many believe that it is God who decides on our souls not some man here on earth. One thing about Freemasonry it is a path of enlightenment to your maker.


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## RyanC (Apr 20, 2014)

I have a question, you say you want to become a Knights Templar, does that mean you would take all their vows too, poverty, chastity and obedience.


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## sirknight7 (Apr 20, 2014)

Red, you ask if you should join freemasonry, you want to become a Knights Templar? Keeping in mind that masonry is somewhat different from place to place, becoming a mason should be in your heart, if your a master mason and believe in Christ then you can apply to become a Knights Templar, many jurisdictions are different but I am fortunate to belong to one that takes our vows of becoming one a life changing event, not everyone views appending body's of masonry as seriously. 
Sir Knight
Nick

Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Tapatalk


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## Brother JC (Apr 20, 2014)

There are a number of "Templar" organizations in the world besides the Masonic ones, and as was previously mentioned, none have a direct lineage to the original.
Freemasonry, per se, does not use Templar images. Some of the appendant bodies do, however. The image you posted shows some of those bodies, as they exist in the UK.


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## Mac (Apr 20, 2014)

trysquare said:


> There are a number of "Templar" organizations in the world besides the Masonic ones, and as was previously mentioned, none have a direct lineage to the original.
> Freemasonry, per se, does not use Templar images. Some of the appendant bodies do, however. The image you posted shows some of those bodies, as they exist in the UK.



Did the SMOTJ at one point claim they were linked to the original order?  My understanding is that they no longer do.

The original poster and others might benefit from hearing about the purpose and activities of the current Masonic KT. 


Sent via mobile app (Freemason Connect HD)


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## Red942 (Apr 21, 2014)

RyanC said:


> I have a question, you say you want to become a Knights Templar, does that mean you would take all their vows too, poverty, chastity and obedience.


 Yes if they are the same


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## Mike Martin (Apr 21, 2014)

Hi Red,
Sometimes people complicate things, the very simple answers to your actual questions are:

1) There is no actual link between Freemasonry and the Poor Fellow Soldiers of Christ and the Temple.
2) No if you want to be come a an actual KNight Templar there is no point in you joining Freemasonry.
3) If you actually believe that the original Order still exists you need to direct your enquiry to the Vatican! The original monastic Order answered to the Pope and none other.

4) Just to clarify one further point the Holy See (as announced many times by the Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith) considers any Catholic who becomes a Freemason to be in a "state of grave sin" and has done for over 200 years. Some people should check with the source rather than repeating what they hear or see elsewhere.

The last and un-changed declaration can be read here: http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/c...19850223_declaration-masonic_articolo_en.html


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