# Examining a Brother



## Blake Bowden (Jan 11, 2009)

Many of you have attended Lodges across the US and abroad, but which one was the most thorough in their examination? I've heard that some require you to give the grip of a MM, obligation, tylers oath, and more!  I can barely remember the MM obligation and have yet to learn the Tylers oath.


----------



## Wingnut (Jan 11, 2009)

Ive only visited Texas lodges, but a dues card was all I ever had to do/go through.


----------



## cale (Jan 11, 2009)

In Wyoming and New Mexico, the lodges that I visited varied the most I was ask, beyound my dues card, was the grip and word and once the tylers oath, but the grand hailing sign of distress should give you instruction if you git stuck


----------



## jwardl (Jan 11, 2009)

Have only attended our neighboring lodge thus far, but was asked for my dues card (which the two examining me also displayed), the grip of a MM, and the Tiler's Oath.

Our DDGM (also a brother from my lodge) was present at the time. He said he would have vouched for me, but thought I might wish to experience the full exam as a then-new MM.


----------



## nick1368 (Jan 11, 2009)

I have visited several area lodges but I because I was there with someone I have never been exaimined. When I was Sr Deacon I exaimined a visiting brother....I just asked for his Dues card, showed him mine and he gave me the grip ....


----------



## ravickery03 (Jan 11, 2009)

In Virgina they had me do all grips and words, along with the Tyler's Oath and the sign of distress.  In New Mexico all they asked for was my dues card and DI.

-Bro Vick


----------



## Joey (Jan 11, 2009)

All Bro. Blake and I have ever been asked for is our dues card and drivers license.


----------



## TexMass (Jan 12, 2009)

In both NJ and PA I was asked for a dues card.  In PA I was asked about the 5 points and in NJ I had to explain the positions of the S&C through the degrees.  When I came to my current MA lodge I was asked for my dues card, the strong grip of a mason and then was given an application for affiliation.  No lie.


----------



## RJS (Jan 12, 2009)

I have only visited lodges in Texas and have been asked only for my dues card and drivers license.


----------



## Scotty32 (Jan 12, 2009)

We are going to start teaching new MM's the Tyler's Oath. For entrance, most of the time its a photo ID & dues card. And occasionally you got to a place that asks for nothing.


----------



## rhitland (Jan 13, 2009)

Nash Lodge 638 had me give the Tilers oath and it is pretty simple, and my dues card and DL, afterward I had along talk with Brother Billy Graham about some of the question that used to be asked my favorite was how many workmen completed the temple of Solomon. took me a minute but I got it.


----------



## cmoreno85tx (Jan 13, 2009)

When I visted Beeville Lodge it was the first Lodge I had been to by myself. they asked for my dues card and driver's license and asked if I knew the Tiler's Oath. I told them that I had heard of it but had not been taught. They were Brotherly enough to educated me


----------



## js4253 (Jan 17, 2009)

I have never been examined.


----------



## Brother Secretary (Jan 19, 2009)

If you know the EA work, you know the Tilers Oath. I have examined many a visiting brother. If there is nobody to vouch for them I feel proper procedure is to inspect a *current* dues card and *valid* photo ID, check in the book of constituent lodges to ensure the lodge is real, and then *administer* the Tiler's Oath... this usually starts out with Brother Senior Deacon or myself saying, "please place your hand upon the bible and repeat after me." It's an oath, not memory work... or at least that's how I handle it.

When I spent 10 months in Louisiana I checked in first with the General Secretary of the local Scottish Rite Valley and attended a SR Stated meeting and was there announced as a visiting Brother from the Valley of Austin. There I met a bunch of Brothers who said, "come visit, our stated meeting is next....." Thus when I went to visit usually there was someone to vouch for me, "oh yeah, I sat with him in the Consistory last month."

A few times in Louisiana I did have to show ID / Dues cards and give signs.


----------



## js4253 (Jan 20, 2009)

All that is required of a Texas Mason is a current dues card and photo ID. I'm not sure why anyone would require the Tiler's Oath.


----------



## RJS (Jan 20, 2009)

js4253 said:


> All that is required of a Texas Mason is a current dues card and photo ID. I'm not sure why anyone would require the Tiler's Oath.


I would guess that it was probably a tradition of that lodge to do so.


----------



## Wingnut (Jan 20, 2009)

someone saw it in that blue book that we used to not be able to own perhaps?


----------



## ravickery03 (Jan 20, 2009)

js4253 said:


> All that is required of a Texas Mason is a current dues card and photo ID. I'm not sure why anyone would require the Tiler's Oath.



In Texas, that isn't the case in other jurisdictions.  For outsiders from other states I typically examine them.

I did it when we had the brother from Alaska visit for the MM degree that you attended.


----------



## Brother Secretary (Jan 20, 2009)

you're correct, JS while the Tilers Oath is not a requirement, I sure do feel better after looking them in the eye, while their hand is upon the bible next to mine, and hearing my visiting Brother say, "and know of no just reason why I should be." 

A dues card and ID is sort of business like... taking that oath & swearing before, "almighty God and these witnesses," puts a rather personal touch on it.


----------



## Blake Bowden (Jan 21, 2009)

js4253 said:


> I have never been examined.



I'll never forget the time Brother Joey and I visited Mina Lodge in Bastrop and the SW made it very clear that HE WAS NOT satisfied to open a MM Lodge lol. Fortunately a member vouched for us and we proceeded. For my fellow SD's, examine visiting Brother until you are satisfied. Personally, I respect those Lodges who take the time to examine.


----------



## ragged tiger (Jan 21, 2009)

Brother Secretary said:


> you're correct, JS while the Tilers Oath is not a requirement, I sure do feel better after looking them in the eye, while their hand is upon the bible next to mine, and hearing my visiting Brother say, "and know of no just reason why I should be."
> 
> A dues card and ID is sort of business like... taking that oath & swearing before, "almighty God and these witnesses," puts a rather personal touch on it.


I visited a lodge in Augusta, Georgia and was required to show a current dues card and recite the Tyler's Oath.  Being F. & A.M. their version of the oath was slightly different, but they had no problem accepting the version I put forth.  The Tyler's Oath is really something all traveling brothers should know.


----------



## scottmh59 (Oct 26, 2009)

Tom and I visited a lodge in Arlington,and had to give the tylers oath,grip and word of a MM.


----------



## david918 (Oct 26, 2009)

The first lodge I visited after I was raised was in San Antonio and I had to give the grip and word for all three degrees as well as the tilers oath.I have visited over 80 lodges since in 2 countries and numerous states and that was by far the most thorough exam I ever went thru.Almost scared me off


----------



## JBD (Oct 26, 2009)

One lodge in AR was MM token 
One Lodge in AL was oath, all grips and words

Texas is (for TX Masons) Dues Card and DL AND permission of WM


----------



## Bill Lins (Oct 27, 2009)

js4253 said:


> I'm not sure why anyone would require the Tiler's Oath.



The dues card only tells you that the Brother was OK when it was issued. The oath makes him state that he has not been suspended or expelled, nor is he laboring under charges, any of which would be reason enough to exclude him.


----------



## Bill Lins (Oct 27, 2009)

blake said:


> I'll never forget the time Brother Joey and I visited Mina Lodge in Bastrop and the SW made it very clear that HE WAS NOT satisfied to open a MM Lodge.



I'm not sure how "emphatic" he might have been, but he DID follow correct procedure if he had not sat in Lodge with y'all before.


----------



## Bill Lins (Oct 27, 2009)

I have no problem with being examined as long as the SD isn't wearing surgical gloves. :48:


----------



## RedTemplar (Oct 27, 2009)

One thing I have found is when you see you are about to be asked a lot of questions, it can be hushed rather quickly when you exercise your right as a visiting Master Mason to to try the lodge. Brothers tend to change the subject very quickly when you ask to see the lodge's charter, book of constitution, and etc.


----------



## Wingnut (Oct 27, 2009)

JBD said:


> Texas is (for TX Masons) Dues Card and DL AND permission of WM



I do believe the way I read the law permission is NOT needed of the WM, in fact he can not refuse entry.  This is also the way it was presented by PGM Elmer Murphy when the issue came up for an unrelated reason.


----------



## JBD (Oct 27, 2009)

Wingnut said:


> I do believe the way I read the law permission is NOT needed of the WM, in fact he can not refuse entry.  This is also the way it was presented by PGM Elmer Murphy when the issue came up for an unrelated reason.



Art. 380. (416). Good Standing. Upon notification to the
Worshipful Master, and at his discretion, a member of a Lodge
under the jurisdiction of this Grand Lodge may visit any Texas
Masonic Lodge working under this jurisdiction without the
avouchment and or examination process providing that he is in
good standing and presents a receipt from his Lodge showing
that his dues are current at the time of said visitation along
with a photo identification; except in cases provided for in Art.
382.


----------



## TCShelton (Oct 27, 2009)

Wingnut said:


> I do believe the way I read the law permission is NOT needed of the WM, in fact he can not refuse entry.



+1 to having heard that from GL.


----------



## Wingnut (Oct 27, 2009)

JBD said:


> Art. 380. (416). Good Standing. Upon notification to the
> Worshipful Master, and at his discretion, a member of a Lodge
> under the jurisdiction of this Grand Lodge may visit any Texas
> Masonic Lodge working under this jurisdiction without the
> ...



PM sent


----------



## JBD (Oct 27, 2009)

Wingnut said:


> PM sent




Whur??? It appears to be cyrber MIA


----------



## Griffin (Oct 27, 2009)

The last 2 lodges I visited, Mill Valley in California and Arlington Heights here in Fort Worth, both required a dues card and DL, and both asked for the Tiler's Oath, which I gave.  Nobody asked for signs, grips or words, though at Arlington Heights I was asked if I knew them. Of all those ritual means of recognition, I think at least the signs should be demonstrated because I have seen brothers do some of the strangest things during the opening and closing of lodge.  Sometimes it's more confusing than watching the batting coach of minor league baseball team! :blink:


----------



## Gerald.Harris (Oct 27, 2009)

Article 223- Necessary Paraphernalia for Lodges in Texas ( item 17) Requires that each Texas Lodge have a small Bible for an Examining Committie. Other then that I am not aware of any other guide lines for determining if a brother is worthy to come inside or not. In years past, I have seen G&Ws and Tilers Oath being the most often utilized examination. I think we must all keep in mind that the only way a brother can ( legally) vouch for another is if he has set in a tiled Lodge with him, or if he was on his examining committie. The proper time to vouch for someone is during the opening ceremonies.  I don't believe that any lodge has ever attempted to keep me out, but rather worked to get me inside the lodge room.  Each Master of a Lodge when installed is charged with not allowing any unknown brother into his lodge room without proper examination .


----------



## MGM357 (Oct 27, 2009)

Often tried, neve denied and willing to be tried again.


----------



## Bill Lins (Oct 28, 2009)

Wingnut said:


> I do believe the way I read the law permission is NOT needed of the WM, in fact he can not refuse entry.



OK, guys- that's not what it means. Allowing entry _based on a dues card & photo ID in lieu of an examination_ is what is left up to the WM's discretion.


----------



## Gerald.Harris (Oct 28, 2009)

js4253 said:


> All that is required of a Texas Mason is a current dues card and photo ID. I'm not sure why anyone would require the Tiler's Oath.



Because that is not all that is required, in fact a dues  card isn't even required anywhere in the Constitution except under article 380:which says: 

Upon notification to the Worshipful Master, *and at his discretion*, a member of a Lodge under the jourisdiction of this Grand Lodge may visit any Texas Masonic Lodge working under this jourisdiction without the avouchment and or examination proces providing that he is in good standing and presents a receipt from his Lodge showing that his dues are current at the time of said visitation along with a photo identification;except in cases provided for in Art.382. Sojourning Masons from other jourisdictions must possess a current dues card and shall be vouched for or examined in accordance with Art.381.


----------



## kcir (Jan 21, 2010)

At the very least, you should be asked for your dues card and the members of the examining committee should show theirs.  You should then be offered the opportunity  to look in the book  of lodges and see that he lodge you are visiting is recognized by the Grand Lodge.


----------



## webstermason (Jan 30, 2010)

I've told older visiting brothers that they must arm wrestle me for entry.


----------



## js4253 (Jan 30, 2010)

Gerald.Harris said:


> Because that is not all that is required, in fact a dues  card isn't even required anywhere in the Constitution except under article 380:which says:
> 
> Upon notification to the Worshipful Master, *and at his discretion*, a member of a Lodge under the jourisdiction of this Grand Lodge may visit any Texas Masonic Lodge working under this jourisdiction without the avouchment and or examination proces providing that he is in good standing and presents a receipt from his Lodge showing that his dues are current at the time of said visitation along with a photo identification;except in cases provided for in Art.382. Sojourning Masons from other jourisdictions must possess a current dues card and shall be vouched for or examined in accordance with Art.381.



Are you telling me brother Harris that everytime you visit a Texas Lodge, you take a receipt from your lodge to prove you are in good standing?  No, you show your dues card. Picky picky picky


----------



## Bill Lins (Jan 30, 2010)

js4253 said:


> Are you telling me brother Harris that everytime you visit a Texas Lodge, you take a receipt from your lodge to prove you are in good standing?  No, you show your dues card. Picky picky picky


 
Bro. Hale, I believe you missed the point Bro. Gerald was attempting to make. You originally stated that a Texas Mason could gain entry into any Texas Lodge merely by showing his dues card & a photo ID. Bro. Gerald merely added that, per Grand Lodge Law, it is up to the WM of that Lodge as to whether or not he would require an examination. That is why he emphasized *"and at his discretion"* in his post. He believes, *as do I*, that if we are going to post about Grand Lodge Law we need to take the time to make sure we are posting accurately and *in full*. There are many young Masons who might get themselves in a bind by relying upon information they read here- we owe it to them to get it right.


----------



## js4253 (Jan 31, 2010)

Bill_Lins77488 said:


> Bro. Hale, I believe you missed the point Bro. Gerald was attempting to make. You originally stated that a Texas Mason could gain entry into any Texas Lodge merely by showing his dues card & a photo ID. Bro. Gerald merely added that, per Grand Lodge Law, it is up to the WM of that Lodge as to whether or not he would require an examination. That is why he emphasized *"and at his discretion"* in his post. He believes, *as do I*, that if we are going to post about Grand Lodge Law we need to take the time to make sure we are posting accurately and *in full*. There are many young Masons who might get themselves in a bind by relying upon information they read here- we owe it to them to get it right.


 
I'm sorry.  I was not quoting Grand Lodge Law, only my opinion.  I don't consider myself a Masonic lawyer. I just think we go to extremes  sometimes.  I can't think of a reason that I would require an examination of a Texas  Brother who wanted to visit my Lodge, if he had a current dues card and photo I.D.  I'm sure there will be many examples.  As I have stated before, I think we should encourage visitation, not try to prevent visitation.  That is why I emphasized my opinion *picky picky picky*


----------



## JEbeling (Jan 31, 2010)

Whoa.... ! if I am master of a lodge... ! a brother comes to visit my lodge and shows a dues card ... ! and is not a member of that lodge... ! and no one can knows him ... ! he will ALWAYS stand an exam... ! if nothing else than going thru the tilers oath and a couple of questions.. ! it doesn't take long and ever brother I have exam ed have always been enjoyed the exam.. !


----------



## js4253 (Jan 31, 2010)

JEbeling said:


> Whoa.... ! if I am master of a lodge... ! a brother comes to visit my lodge and shows a dues card ... ! and is not a member of that lodge... ! and no one can knows him ... ! he will ALWAYS stand an exam... ! if nothing else than going thru the tilers oath and a couple of questions.. ! it doesn't take long and ever brother I have exam ed have always been enjoyed the exam.. !


 
I know what you mean about enjoying the exam.  I recently visited a Lodge in Ohio and the question I was asked was: Who died first, Hiram Abif's mother or father?  I thought that was a unique way to examine a Brother.


----------



## JEbeling (Jan 31, 2010)

I was ask once if I was given a blue apron for the blue lodge..?


----------



## Bill Lins (Jan 31, 2010)

js4253 said:


> I can't think of a reason that I would require an examination of a Texas  Brother who wanted to visit my Lodge, if he had a current dues card and photo I.D.


 
I can think of at least two. First, all that a dues card tells you is that the Brother was in good standing at the time he paid his dues. The Tiler's Oath requires him to swear that he is *currently* in good standing, i.e. not suspended, expelled, or under charges.

Secondly, about 6 or so years ago, we received a notice from the Grand Secretary regarding a "Brother" who got into a Lodge in the Huntsville area with nothing more than a photo ID & dues card. Everything was fine until his third visit, when he was recognized as a parolee by a real Brother who happened to be a TDCJ captain. Turns out the guy made his dues card in the prison print shop.


----------



## js4253 (Jan 31, 2010)

Bill_Lins77488 said:


> I can think of at least two. First, all that a dues card tells you is that the Brother was in good standing at the time he paid his dues. The Tiler's Oath requires him to swear that he is *currently* in good standing, i.e. not suspended, expelled, or under charges.
> 
> Secondly, about 6 or so years ago, we received a notice from the Grand Secretary regarding a "Brother" who got into a Lodge in the Huntsville area with nothing more than a photo ID & dues card. Everything was fine until his third visit, when he was recognized as a parolee by a real Brother who happened to be a TDCJ captain. Turns out the guy made his dues card in the prison print shop.


 
It can happen.


----------



## TexMass (Jan 31, 2010)

After 9/11 we have to take our shoes off.  We are now looking at unerwear searches too.  Oh wait...wrong thread.


----------



## Gerald.Harris (Feb 1, 2010)

js4253 said:


> Are you telling me brother Harris that everytime you visit a Texas Lodge, you take a receipt from your lodge to prove you are in good standing?  No, you show your dues card. Picky picky picky


 
Brother Hale, your dues card is your receipt, and Brother Lins was correct in a latter post. Myself and a few other brothers who have been around a while, just want to make sure that all of our younger brothers don't get themselves in a pickle by quoteing or saying something based upon what someone posts here on this site. In over 30 years I have visited many many lodges in Texas as well as the rest of the world. I have never been unable to gain admission into any of them.


----------



## kcir (Feb 1, 2010)

Yes its important that the brother visiting should have a valid dues card and identity card.  The book of lodges should also be consulted to insure that his lodge is recognized.  The visiting brother should also be given the opportunity to check the book to insure that the lodge he is visiting is a recognized lodge.  I also like to ask for the tylers oath.  Its not that hard to learn and shows that you are proud to be a mason.  If you don't know it, it can be read and repeated by the visiting brother.  I think that little things like this make the brothers visit special.  In my lodge we have an officer of the lodge appointed to meet visiting brothers, especially first time visitors.  They are introduced to the brothers present before lodge opens, make sure they get a meal if one is being offered, and given a tour of the lodge facilities.  In lodge, first time visitors are, if room is available, asked to have a seat in the east.  This really makes their visit special and makes them want to visit again.


----------



## js4253 (Feb 2, 2010)

Gerald.Harris said:


> Brother Hale, your dues card is your receipt, and Brother Lins was correct in a latter post. Myself and a few other brothers who have been around a while, just want to make sure that all of our younger brothers don't get themselves in a pickle by quoteing or saying something based upon what someone posts here on this site. In over 30 years I have visited many many lodges in Texas as well as the rest of the world. I have never been unable to gain admission into any of them.


 
Your post is 100% accurate.  My bad.  What concerns me is that I have talked to many older Masons who told me " I couldn't get in the Lodge because I don't remember all the grips and words"  I know we can get him to repeat the tilers oath and help him gain access or get him to answer some key questions to verify if he is a Mason.  The problem is most of them are embarrassed or don't want to go to the trouble.  I want everyone who is a Mason to feel he is welcome so they will attend Lodge.  That's all.  I want the fraternity to thrive as it has in the past.  I do agree that if the Worshipful Master feels the person visiting is a cowan or eavesdroper, suspended or expelled, that he should request an examination.  Peace be with you Brother Harris.


----------



## Wingnut (Feb 2, 2010)

again... if you examine to KEEP BROTHERS OUT you can always find away to keep them out.  If you examine to GET BROTHERS IN you can find ways to do it also.  Ive seen some pretty interesting questioning of men that havent been in a lodge in 40+ years.


----------



## caeservi (Feb 2, 2010)

when in the D.C. area, I visited Naval Lodge in the D.C. grand lodge jurisdiction and Alexandria Washington at the G.W. Memorial in the GL of Virginia jurisdiction.  Alexandria had me give the step, dugard, and pass word after checking my dues card and looking at their list of lodges. then had me read the tilers oath while touching the bible.  Naval Lodge just had me give the tilers oath.


----------



## Lee Crites (May 27, 2011)

Blake Bowden said:


> I can barely remember the MM obligation and have yet to learn the Tylers oath.




I can honestly say I don't remember the MM obligation well enough to give it as a challenge like that. It took me quite a while to find someone who actually KNEW the Tyler's Oath, which I did learn.

I can say this, though: not being sure of what I'd be asked and/or of my ability to pass the exam has limited the number of lodges I have visited. If I didn't know a lot of the folks there already, I haven't gone. Period.


----------



## Timothy Fleischer (May 27, 2011)

Scotty32 said:


> We are going to start teaching new MM's the Tyler's Oath. For entrance, most of the time its a photo ID & dues card. And occasionally you got to a place that asks for nothing.


 
Brother,

As part of the MM exam, our lodge requires the Tyler's Oath so that the new MM can travel to other lodges. It is a good thing to add to the education of new MM, in my opinion.


----------



## JTM (May 27, 2011)

Start a new thread to continue the discussion.  Lots of old threads contain posts by folks that aren't members of the boards anymore so they it breaks the frames.  No worries, I just want threads without broken frames


----------

