# what do we know about the Illuminati?



## Alfie13 (May 12, 2016)

The Illuminati is one of the world's most famous secret organizations. Their rumored membership includes many public figures. So, what do we know about the Illuminati?


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## Ripcord22A (May 12, 2016)

We know that they arent real and have ZERO connection to Freemasonry.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illuminati

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## Ripcord22A (May 12, 2016)

What?

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## Brother JC (May 12, 2016)

The Illuminati was short-lived and is now a regurgitated product of '60s fiction and a hoax. Even though it was a known hoax, it, like Taxil's hoax, continues to live on in those who believe everything they read.


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## chrmc (May 12, 2016)

We in fact do know quite a lot about the historic Illuminati, and they were very much inspired by masonic ritual, and also shared members. 
All their rituals have been published in a very good book here recently. 
http://www.amazon.com/Secret-School-Wisdom-Authentic-Illuminati/dp/0853184933/

As for the modern day conspiracy theories, I'd suggest to take them elsewhere.


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## Bloke (May 12, 2016)

chrmc said:


> All their rituals have been published in a very good book here recently.
> http://www.amazon.com/Secret-School-Wisdom-Authentic-Illuminati/dp/0853184933/




Not sure I'd spend a dime on that book - is it about the Bavarian Illuminati, the level in the OTO or one of the other groups which adopted the name?? I've got some at the bottom of the garden plotting WW3 and the NWO, Margaret Thatcher leads them because she's actually not dead...

I've been into this thread but ignored it... but thought I would watch the video, heard the x-files theme, then got to "reptiles" and tried to hang on...but got to about a minute in.. skipped forward to look at image and saw Albert Pike  and then stopped watching..

To understand this stuff, just substitute the word "Illuminati" for the word "boogeyman", the words "reported" and "thought" and "believed" and "reputed" for the phrase "made up" and you have a good source of information


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## Brother JC (May 12, 2016)

The book mentioned is about the Bavarian Illuminati. It is well-researched and well-presented, not a conspiracy theory in sight.


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## Brother JC (May 12, 2016)

A Brother has re-created the jewel from that period based on information in the book...


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## chrmc (May 13, 2016)

Bloke said:


> Not sure I'd spend a dime on that book - is it about the Bavarian Illuminati, the level in the OTO or one of the other groups which adopted the name?? I've got some at the bottom of the garden plotting WW3 and the NWO, Margaret Thatcher leads them because she's actually not dead...
> 
> I've been into this thread but ignored it... but thought I would watch the video, heard the x-files theme, then got to "reptiles" and tried to hang on...but got to about a minute in.. skipped forward to look at image and saw Albert Pike and then stopped watching..
> 
> To understand this stuff, just substitute the word "Illuminati" for the word "boogeyman", the words "reported" and "thought" and "believed" and "reputed" for the phrase "made up" and you have a good source of information



I'm sorry, but I think you very unjustly discredit a book you haven't read. The authors are scholars, and one even a Brother from Texas, who have spent years in studying to original Bavarian Illuminati texts and translated them from German. This book is the first publication ever that has taken Adam Weishap's original texts and published them to a wider audience. It is of immense value to scholars and anyone who is actually studying the historical Illuminati. 

So as I've said earlier, you can keep your conspiracy theories to yourself, but don't discredit actual scholarly work that is out there.


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## tldubb (May 13, 2016)

That it is real just like the Easter Bunny!


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## dfreybur (May 13, 2016)

tldubb said:


> That it is real just like the Easter Bunny!



Even better.  Discussion of the Illuminati makes for an easy measurement of something we care about in candidates - Being of sound mind.  It's like a canary in a coal mine.


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## Warrior1256 (May 13, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> We know that they arent real and have ZERO connection to Freemasonry.





Brother JC said:


> The Illuminati was short-lived and is now a regurgitated product of '60s fiction and a hoax.





tldubb said:


> That it is real just like the Easter Bunny!


All very true.


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## chrmc (May 13, 2016)

Warrior1256 said:


> All very true.



Actually it isn't. Masonry and the Illuminati is linked historically. Adam Weishaupt was a mason and the whole setup of the order and the degree system is influenced what he though was wrong with Masonry and how it could be done better. Several of their degrees were also basically altered masonic degrees. 

We may not like the associations that the word Illuminati brings in modern time. But let's not try and change historical fact just because of that.


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## tldubb (May 13, 2016)

chrmc said:


> Actually it isn't. Masonry and the Illuminati is linked historically. Adam Weishaupt was a mason and the whole setup of the order and the degree system is influenced what he though was wrong with Masonry and how it could be done better. Several of their degrees were also basically altered masonic degrees.
> 
> We may not like the associations that the word Illuminati brings in modern time. But let's not try and change historical fact just because of that.


LOL!!..Really


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## tldubb (May 13, 2016)

Saying to myself LSD, COKE, CANNABIS...got it! ILLUMINATI KOOL-AID fracking SUGAR the worst drug of all..sounds like you OD on the Illuminati Kool aid.. 


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## chrmc (May 13, 2016)

tldubb said:


> Saying to myself LSD, COKE, CANNABIS...got it! ILLUMINATI KOOL-AID fracking SUGAR the worst drug of all..sounds like you OD on the Illuminati Kool aid..
> Sent from my iPhone using My Freemasonry Pro



I'll ignore the rather rude and unmasonic comments you start with, and try and keep this factual and ask which part of my statement was incorrect?

Adam Weishaupt was initiated in the lodge "Theodor zum guten Rath" in Munich in 1777.
In the Illuminati rituals the second set of rituals were called "The Freemasonic class" and had an EA, FC and an MM degree largely ripped of from freemasonry. These were followed by a Scottish Novice degree.
So if Masonry and the Illuminati wasn't tied together directly one has to acknowledge that the founder of the order was a mason, had quite a lot of masonic inspiration when making the degrees and to a large extent recruited from masonic circles.

None of this should really be very surprising nor disturbing, and is well know historical fact. I'm a little shocked if we as masons can't distinguish historic facts from modern day conspiracy theories...


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## Brother JC (May 13, 2016)

Sadly, the facts have been crushed over the years by the massive assault of fiction, especially since the advent of the Internet. People used to have to wait for a new edition of the Enquirer to get what they now read daily.


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## Ripcord22A (May 13, 2016)

chrmc said:


> I'll ignore the rather rude and unmasonic comments you start with, and try and keep this factual and ask which part of my statement was incorrect?
> 
> Adam Weishaupt was initiated in the lodge "Theodor zum guten Rath" in Munich in 1777.
> In the Illuminati rituals the second set of rituals were called "The Freemasonic class" and had an EA, FC and an MM degree largely ripped of from freemasonry. These were followed by a Scottish Novice degree.
> ...


Source please?  Ive never heard any of that before

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## tldubb (May 14, 2016)

chrmc said:


> I'll ignore the rather rude and unmasonic comments you start with, and try and keep this factual and ask which part of my statement was incorrect?
> 
> Adam Weishaupt was initiated in the lodge "Theodor zum guten Rath" in Munich in 1777.
> In the Illuminati rituals the second set of rituals were called "The Freemasonic class" and had an EA, FC and an MM degree largely ripped of from freemasonry. These were followed by a Scottish Novice degree.
> ...


Still leave the Kool-Aid alone, let's get this straight nothing on this thread has anything to do with talking " Masonic " talk. When you try to come up with this connection between Illuminati and Freemasonry. As Brother Jdmads, has asked cite your source and not this same old Adam Weishaumpt...story. Big Oh yaaah!   


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## SimonM (May 14, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> Source please?  Ive never heard any of that before
> 
> Sent from my LG-H811 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app


The book that bro Chrmc recommended is a good source:
http://www.amazon.com/Secret-School-Wisdom-Authentic-Illuminati/dp/0853184933/

If you just want to get the quick facts wikipedia is quite good
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illuminati


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## tldubb (May 14, 2016)

Just one source? Usually for something to be consider fact or factual you usually have multitude of sources not just one. Being able to stand up to the veracity of the authors claim.


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## tldubb (May 14, 2016)

I believe in seeking knowledge from the cradle to the grave, so I'll try to download the book..


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## Ripcord22A (May 14, 2016)

I already posted the wiki link...nothing in there says anything about the "degrees" in illuminati

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## chrmc (May 14, 2016)

Best source is again the book I reference. They have info to all the original sources in German.
However also check https://bavarianilluminati.wordpress.com/ which is one of the authors blogs. Especially https://bavarianilluminati.wordpress.com/2014/07/12/scottish-knight-degree-excerpt/ and https://bavarianilluminati.wordpress.com/2013/12/21/progression-of-the-illuminati-ritual/

Brother Wages was also on the Winding stairs podcast and a couple of others.


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## chrmc (May 14, 2016)

tldubb said:


> Still leave the Kool-Aid alone, let's get this straight nothing on this thread has anything to do with talking " Masonic " talk. When you try to come up with this connection between Illuminati and Freemasonry. As Brother Jdmads, has asked cite your source and not this same old Adam Weishaumpt...story. Big Oh yaaah!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using My Freemasonry Pro



Why would it be so terrible if Weishaupt was a Mason? I don't get that? Most of the various seekers at that time dabbled in various societies and paths of illumination. 

Again, there's a difference in the historical order and the nonsense we see today.


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## tldubb (May 14, 2016)

@chrmc, are you a mason?

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## chrmc (May 14, 2016)

tldubb said:


> @chrmc, are you a mason?
> 
> Sent from my LG-V495 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app



Yes. Though I hardly see how that has bearing on the discussion.


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## MarkR (May 15, 2016)

Yes, Weishaupt was a Mason.  He recruited many men from Bavarian lodges for the Illuminati.  But Freemasonry did not sanction it.

The rituals of the Illuminati are now available if you're interested: http://www.lewismasonic.co.uk/the-s...ic-rituals-and-doctrine-of-the-illuminati.htm


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## Bloke (May 15, 2016)

chrmc said:


> Best source is again the book I reference. They have info to all the original sources in German.
> However also check https://bavarianilluminati.wordpress.com/ which is one of the authors blogs. Especially https://bavarianilluminati.wordpress.com/2014/07/12/scottish-knight-degree-excerpt/ and https://bavarianilluminati.wordpress.com/2013/12/21/progression-of-the-illuminati-ritual/
> 
> Brother Wages was also on the Winding stairs podcast and a couple of others.



Thanks for the recommendation and comments. If a good book as you say, I might look into it. 

So, this is sort of like the OTO or Golden Dawn being linked to Freemasonry by vitue of early movers of those organisations being Freemasons and like other organisations who borrow from Freemasonry ?


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## Ressam (May 15, 2016)

MarkR said:


> Yes, Weishaupt was a Mason.  He recruited many men from Bavarian lodges for the Illuminati.  But Freemasonry did not sanction it.
> 
> The rituals of the Illuminati are now available if you're interested: http://www.lewismasonic.co.uk/the-s...ic-rituals-and-doctrine-of-the-illuminati.htm


Hello, Sir.
If possible, could You, please tell more about this moment -- "But Freemasonry didn't sanction it"?
Who? Grand Master? What Lodge? How was that "process" going? Just interested in that historic moment.
Thanks!


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## Ressam (May 15, 2016)

[Posted twice by mistake].
My apologies.


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## tldubb (May 15, 2016)

Exactly, just because one " brother " in the order was involved in the illuminati recruiting, cheerleading, or what have you.

 How is it that it makes the leap to the Craft as a whole?



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## dfreybur (May 15, 2016)

tldubb said:


> How is it that it makes the leap to the Craft as a whole?



The founders of the Illuminati were Brothers.  Most of the members were Brothers.  Denying this history is a bad idea.

The Illuminati were ejected from Masonry for participating in politics.  Membership was banned by civic law.  The organization has gone the way of the dodo bird.

People who start discussions of the Illuminati are conspiracy theory nut cases.  It's a useful litmus test for who is not of sound mind.  But once the topic is brought up the actual history is the actual history.  That they don't exist now and have not existed for over a century does not mean they never existed.  This too is a litmus test for being of sound mind.  Making the leap to the Craft as a whole OR denying that they ever existed are both irrational stances.

That's Brother Chris from Helotes Lodge near San Antonio, right?  I have sat in tiled lodge with him.


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## SimonM (May 15, 2016)

Bloke said:


> So, this is sort of like the OTO or Golden Dawn being linked to Freemasonry by vitue of early movers of those organisations being Freemasons and like other organisations who borrow from Freemasonry ?



Not quite, the founders of OTO and GD were first freemasons and then created the new orders which can be seen as irregular high degrees or rites. Separate from the family of freemasonry, but still very closely related.

The Bavarian Illuminati had its origin in the student fraternaties of the German universities. Wieshaupt was later initiated into freemasonry and borrowed lots of material from the craft degrees to his order but it was always a separate thing, unrelated to the masonic family. 


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## tldubb (May 15, 2016)

As I stated make the connections between the " founders of Freemasonry " and the illuminati..


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## Bloke (May 15, 2016)

SimonM said:


> Not quite, the founders of OTO and GD were first freemasons and then created the new orders which can be seen as irregular high degrees or rites. Separate from the family of freemasonry, but still very closely related.
> 
> The Bavarian Illuminati had its origin in the student fraternaties of the German universities. Wieshaupt was later initiated into freemasonry and borrowed lots of material from the craft degrees to his order but it was always a separate thing, unrelated to the masonic family.
> 
> ...



Thanks.


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## Pdwmcdonald (May 15, 2016)

This has been a very interesting discussion, although some Brother's comments less brotherly than others. 

 I think people need to understand early Freemasonry from a European perspective and not from an American one.  In the 18th and 19th century, fraternal organizations and occult societies were popping up all over continental Europe. The easiest way for these organizations to try and sound legitimate were to attach themselves to Freemasony as it was, at the time well known and respected (except by the Catholic Church). A lot of the members of these organizations became Freemasons to try and steal Freemasonry's secrets, rituals and to try and recruit membership.  One of these organizations was the short lived Bavarian Illuminati. Whose founder and members were eventually expelled by the Grand Lodge of Bavaria. Another example was the Antient Order of Gardeners who existed for a short time in Scotland in the 19th Century. Yes, their working tools were in fact, gardening tools! 

Now roll it all forward to the 21st century, every yo-yo with a computer can throw up websites and YouTube videos about the illuminati and its connections to Freemasonry. All the tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorists lap it up as fact. The worst offender of this is a website called Freemasonry watch which also has a Facebook page. 

Good, bad, and often misrepresented Freemasonry has one of the most unique and fascinating histories of any organization in the history of the world. I for one, am proud to be a part of it. Thanks for the tip I'll add this book to my collection. 

In case anybody wants to know. I'm a third generation Freemason and my oldest son just went through his EA Degree.


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## Bloke (May 15, 2016)

Pdwmcdonald said:


> ... Another example was the Antient Order of Gardeners who existed for a short time in Scotland in the 19th Century. Yes, their working tools were in fact, gardening tools!...


...

The ancient order of Gardeners is hanging on in Melbourne with a handful of members. A young and influential Freemason here joined and will soon lead them. He's inviting Freemasons to join and some are - they hold the oldest Free Gardiner Warrant in the world which is still active.

"The Victorian Lodge No. 1 remains the only Fraternal Free Gardeners Lodge in Australia and the Southern Hemisphere. 2014 marks a milestone in the Orders history in celebrating 150 years of the Grand United Order of Free Gardeners in Australia."

http://www.guofg.net.au/

I loaned them an old Constitution which they have just used to re-write theirs which was lost.

They have a facebook page here.


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## Pdwmcdonald (May 16, 2016)

Wow, thank you brother very interesting.


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## Glen Cook (May 16, 2016)

Pdwmcdonald said:


> This has been a very interesting discussion, although some Brother's comments less brotherly than others.
> 
> I think people need to understand early Freemasonry from a European perspective and not from an American one.  In the 18th and 19th century, fraternal organizations and occult societies were popping up all over continental Europe. The easiest way for these organizations to try and sound legitimate were to attach themselves to Freemasony as it was, at the time well known and respected (except by the Catholic Church). A lot of the members of these organizations became Freemasons to try and steal Freemasonry's secrets, rituals and to try and recruit membership.  One of these organizations was the short lived Bavarian Illuminati. Whose founder and members were eventually expelled by the Grand Lodge of Bavaria. Another example was the Antient Order of Gardeners who existed for a short time in Scotland in the 19th Century. Yes, their working tools were in fact, gardening tools!
> 
> ...


Free Gardeners are again active in Scotland: Countess of Elgin Lodge in Kelty. A lodge was also started in the US


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## Bloke (May 16, 2016)

Looking at names on the FB page I know, the order will grow here in Melbourne. They currently read the ritual which means it is easy to drop new members into positions. Give them a few years to rebuild and they will change that, there is a strong culture here of memorizing ritual here (reading it, with two exceptions is banned here by in Masonic Lodges by UGLV) will flow into the Gardeners..


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## Warrior1256 (May 17, 2016)

tldubb said:


> Exactly, just because one " brother " in the order was involved in the illuminati recruiting, cheerleading, or what have you.
> 
> How is it that it makes the leap to the Craft as a whole?





dfreybur said:


> People who start discussions of the Illuminati are conspiracy theory nut cases. It's a useful litmus test for who is not of sound mind.


True.


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## SimonM (May 18, 2016)

Warrior1256 said:


> True.



Actually its not that easy. 

Yes, Illuminati as a conspiracy theory is for nutcases but that is not what we are discussing here. The question is what we know about the shortlived historical order     often called the bavarian Illumniati. 

What we know is that it was more than just one founder who was a mason. Before the goverment found out that they were planning subversive activities they had quite a lot involvement with masonry. During a short while they were accepted by the Grand Lodge of Prussia and they also sent representatives to the great masonic conference in Willhelmsbad in 1782. Luckily for us they didn't win the debate on what to do with masonry after the collapse of the Strict Observance but instead it was Willermoz who founded the Rectified Scottish Rite who won and set the tone for the comming decades.


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## Ripcord22A (May 18, 2016)

SimonM said:


> Actually its not that easy.
> 
> Yes, Illuminati as a conspiracy theory is for nutcases but that is not what we are discussing here. The question is what we know about the shortlived historical order     often called the bavarian Illumniati.
> 
> What we know is that it was more than just one founder who was a mason. Before the goverment found out that they were planning subversive activities they had quite a lot involvement with masonry. During a short while they were accepted by the Grand Lodge of Prussia and they also sent representatives to the great masonic conference in Willhelmsbad in 1782. Luckily for us they didn't win the debate on what to do with masonry after the collapse of the Strict Observance but instead it was Willermoz who founded the Rectified Scottish Rite who won and set the tone for the comming decades.



No the question was about the conspiracy theory nut case Illuminati See below......



Alfie13 said:


> The Illuminati is one of the world's most famous secret organizations. Their rumored membership includes many public figures. So, what do we know about the Illuminati?
> [\QUOTE]
> This poster has only made this one post, and he speaks of their rumored membership.  Today when ever the word Illuminati is spoken they are not talking about the group from the late 1700s.  They are talking about the NWO conspiracy.  Its garbage its bunk whatever.


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## SimonM (May 19, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> No the question was about the conspiracy theory nut case Illuminati See below......


Sorry, my bad!

What I do think is important is that we separate fact from fiction and see what the Illuminati really was, and what they really tried to do before they were shut down. 
Just because there are conspiracy theorist out there making up stuff about the Illuminati doesn't mean we should deny the facts regarding the historical organisation.


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## Erickson Ybarra (May 19, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> We know that they arent real and have ZERO connection to Freemasonry.
> 
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illuminati
> 
> Sent from my LG-H811 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app



Not ENTIRELY true.

Indeed there is no connection to conspiracy theory of shadowy power brokers that are pulling the strings behind the scenes today. But the original Bavarian Illuminati was founded by many who were already Freemasons and created their degrees and rituals based on those of the blue lodge. Of course, this doesn't mean much...it's like Freemasonry's connection with college Greek fraternities.

However, the original Illuminati, albeit secret, was just a philosophical society that believed in enlightenment values..not so different than us in that aspect. They did also use Masonic lodges for bases of operation and even conferred Illuminati degrees in them. They actively tried to recruit Freemasons to join their ranks. When the founder of the society and writer of rituals began to disagree on who had control and it fizzled out over the years.

My source is "The Secret School of Wisdom - The Authentic Rituals and Doctrines of the Illuminati" by Josef Wages, Reinhard Markner, and Jeva Singh-Anand

In fact, George Washington knew that the Illuminati illegally using their lodges and wrote this letter:

_Mount Vernon, October 24, 1798._

_Revd Sir: I have your favor of the 17th. instant before me; and my only motive to trouble you with the receipt of this letter, is to explain, and correct a mistake which I perceive the hurry in which I am obliged, often, to write letters, have led you into._

_It was not my intention to doubt that, the Doctrines of the Illuminati, and principles of Jacobinism had not spread in the United States. On the contrary, no one is more truly satisfied of this fact than I am._

_The idea that I meant to convey, was, that I did not believe that the Lodges of Free Masons in this Country had, as Societies, endeavoured to propagate the diabolical tenets of the first, or pernicious principles of the latter (if they are susceptible of seperation). That Individuals of them may have done it, or that the founder, or instrument employed to found, the Democratic Societies in the United States, may have had these objects; and actually had a seperation of the People from their Government in view, is too evident to be questioned. _

_My occupations are such, that but little leisure is allowed me to read News Papers, or Books of any kind; the reading of letters, and preparing answers, absorb much of my time.

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?ammem/mgwfield(DOCID+@lit(gw360395))_


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## Ripcord22A (May 19, 2016)

Erickson Ybarra said:


> Not ENTIRELY true.
> 
> Indeed there is no connection to conspiracy theory of shadowy power brokers that are pulling the strings behind the scenes today. But the original Bavarian Illuminati was founded by many who were already Freemasons and created their degrees and rituals based on those of the blue lodge. Of course, this doesn't mean much...it's like Freemasonry's connection with college Greek fraternities.
> 
> ...


Again, that is not what he is asking about.  The Bavarian Illuminatti were real, however hes talking about the NWO illuminatti


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## Erickson Ybarra (May 19, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> Again, that is not what he is asking about.  The Bavarian Illuminatti were real, however hes talking about the NWO illuminatti



I know, but the name "Illuminati" should be clarified and taken back from its conspiracy-laced use of today. The OP posted about it on a site for Freemasons so I thought I would share what I've read about the REAL connection between the two.


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## Winter (May 19, 2016)

Sorry.  I couldn't resist.  







Transmitted via my R5 astromech.


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## Erickson Ybarra (May 19, 2016)

Winter said:


> Sorry.  I couldn't resist.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Classic!


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## Ripcord22A (May 19, 2016)

JamestheJust said:


> Ridicule is often used as a means of dissuading investigation.
> 
> Consider the US government agenda of ridiculing the huge numbers of people that have witnessed ufos close up.


HAHAHA holy crap....he finally went there.  He finally went there.....oh man im dying over here.

Im not saying that extra terrestrials don't exist but what I am saying is that if they have the tech to get here, no way do they get see by some back woods toothless yokel in a moomoo drinking a PBR and smoking a virgina slim.  You never hear of a respected business owner or politician talking about it.....thanks James that made my day.


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## Ripcord22A (May 19, 2016)

Yeah cause thats a reputable source.  There isnt any reputable info on his "ufo notes" that i could find

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## Warrior1256 (May 20, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> No the question was about the conspiracy theory nut case Illuminati See below......


Exactly!


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## Warrior1256 (May 20, 2016)

jdmadsenCraterlake211 said:


> HAHAHA holy crap....he finally went there. He finally went there.....oh man im dying over here.


Every now and then he does come up with some doosies!


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## CLewey44 (Dec 8, 2016)

I do think there is a degree of partiality in Masonry that could be perceived as 'good ol' boy' especially if members were say, Presidents or other high officials in the government as has been in the past. Which could further be perceived as NWO/Illuminatiesque.  I think this is a side effect of OUR mentality. Our thoughts of friendship and brotherly love and assisting one another may bleed over into our other decisions. If I'm put in a situation I have to fill a position and it's "Joe Blow" or "Freddy Freemason", I'm probably picking Freddy and I'd  basically expect the same from him. 

I don't think that this is really an obligation but you certainly wouldn't cause a fellow Freemason distress for obvious reason so choosing them over a non-Mason would be the logical choice. Granted of course, he's not some guy who went through the degrees and never showed up again because all he was doing was getting some networking for his business or something.  Then again, that may not be up to my judgement.


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## Magnus (Dec 29, 2017)

Glen Cook said:


> Free Gardeners are again active in Scotland: Countess of Elgin Lodge in Kelty. A lodge was also started in the US


Hello Brother (yes I am a MM), do we know where in the USA is the Gardeners Order? Thanks.


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## Glen Cook (Dec 29, 2017)

Magnus said:


> Hello Brother (yes I am a MM), do we know where in the USA is the Gardeners Order? Thanks.


Salt Lake City. Sego Lilly Lodge.


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## Magnus (Dec 29, 2017)

Glen Cook said:


> Salt Lake City. Sego Lilly Lodge.


Thanks for the response. I appreciate it.


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## Matt L (Dec 29, 2017)

Two things I can't stand, vacuuming the lodge after Commandery Conclaves (Chapeau Plume Feathers) and cleaning the scales from the floor after a Illuminati meeting.


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## Warrior1256 (Dec 29, 2017)

Matt L said:


> Two things I can't stand, vacuuming the lodge after Commandery Conclaves (Chapeau Plume Feathers) and cleaning the scales from the floor after a Illuminati meeting.


Lol!!!!......Yeah, well somebody has to do it.


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## CLewey44 (Dec 30, 2017)

I thought most of the feathers came off of the masquerade masks we wear during the meetings. The scales are a true pain in the tail, I mean ass.


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## Companion Joe (Dec 30, 2017)

Judging by recent TV commercials, the Illuminati opened several Taco Bell franchises.


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## CLewey44 (Dec 30, 2017)

GEICO too.


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## Companion Joe (Dec 30, 2017)

Matt L said:


> Two things I can't stand, vacuuming the lodge after Commandery Conclaves (Chapeau Plume Feathers) and cleaning the scales from the floor after a Illuminati meeting.



Scales = sequin following and OES meeting ... mmmmmm. Just sayin' ... your words, not mine.


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## Warrior1256 (Dec 30, 2017)

CLewey44 said:


> I thought most of the feathers came off of the masquerade masks we wear during the meetings. The scales are a true pain in the tail, I mean ass.





Companion Joe said:


> Judging by recent TV commercials, the Illuminati opened several Taco Bell franchises.





CLewey44 said:


> GEICO too.





Companion Joe said:


> Scales = sequin following and OES meeting ... mmmmmm. Just sayin' ... your words, not mine.


***snicker snicker***


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## JanneProeliator (Dec 31, 2017)

Illuminati is doing jut fine. SOme time a go I recieved a message via Instagram from Illuminati if I wanted to join them. Didn't join yet but you never know.


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## Warrior1256 (Dec 31, 2017)

JanneProeliator said:


> Illuminati is doing jut fine. SOme time a go I recieved a message via Instagram from Illuminati if I wanted to join them. Didn't join yet but you never know.


Why join the Illuminati when us Freemasons know all of the secrets of the universe?????


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## JanneProeliator (Dec 31, 2017)

Warrior1256 said:


> Why join the Illuminati when us Freemasons know all of the secrets of the universe?????


But aren't we run by the Illuminati?


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## CLewey44 (Dec 31, 2017)

One thing I know is, I seriously doubt that any MM I know is secretly a mega rich, all powerful, world-running big wig that masquerades by day as a roofer or a retired postal employee just to cover his tracks. If so, I'm missing out on that deal and help a brother out!


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## Warrior1256 (Dec 31, 2017)

JanneProeliator said:


> But aren't we run by the Illuminati?


No, we run the illuminati!


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## Matt L (Jan 2, 2018)

Companion Joe said:


> Scales = sequin following and OES meeting ... mmmmmm. Just sayin' ... your words, not mine.



Not touching that Joe.


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