# Freemasonry moral values, secret or not?



## johnvranos (Nov 17, 2020)

Hello all,

I am not a Freemason, but I am interested in becoming one.

I study various Freemasonic moral values, I find in the Internet, written by Freemasons.

I try to apply them every day.

An example is the following:

The following is what I believe is a list of what modern Freemasons accept as basic beliefs of Masonic thought. This can be described as a system of belief and therefore an ethical system. One will see in them a positive link to the past. Indeed, I have set them out as fifteen points, copying that of the Regius Manuscript. A speculative Freemason believes:

1) In a God as a Supreme Being;

2) That that God is a creative God who makes the Universe and everything in it, including ourselves;

3) That the Volume of the sacred Law of an individual brother is a spiritual guide for him;

4) That the Craft, (i.e. the speculative system), is formed to promote in the mind of a brother that he is an individual capable of refining his mind, and through that, his conduct;

5) That the way to alter a brother’s thinking is not by compulsion or force, but by demonstration and example;

6) That the way this is done is based on the practices of the ancient operative stonemason, but which today are moralistic in their view on the various subjects concerned, and illustrated by symbols;

7) That a Masonic life can be made by being moral and following the theological and moral virtues and the Masonic principles;

8) That the theological virtues are Faith, Hope and Charity in its widest sense;

9) That the moral virtues are Temperance, Fortitude, Prudence and Justice;

10) That the Masonic principles are Brotherly Love, Relief and Truth;

11) That the characteristics of a Freemason are Virtue, Honour and Mercy;

12) That he has a duty to God, his neighbour and to himself;

13) That a Freemason is a worker, and through his work he gives service to others, by doing which, he fulfils his own innate capabilities;

14) That his physical body is likened to a Temple which houses within it a portion of the Holy Spirit given by God;

15) That his mind, animated by the Spirit of God is, if he follows our teachings, brought to the fullest perfection it is capable of hereon Earth, and that at his death it will be built into the Supreme Being’s Universal Spiritual Temple of Mankind.

No doubt others could add many more items, but these items, numbered one to fifteen, can be described as an invisible boundary within which a man who describes himself as a Freemason could comfortably live.

What then is considered unmasonic? He would be one who stepped outside that invisible boundary. He would be one whose general conduct, wherever he is, within a lodge or out in the world itself, would fall short of the high ideals Freemasons set for themselves. He would do this by dishonest conduct, dissembling, talking behind peoples' backs, carrying tales, toadying to a superior for personal gain, taking work from someone else who is capable of doing it, being an enthusiast or fanatical about something, acting against his employers, the civil authorities or the laws of the country, and by denying a personal belief in a God. In our Craft we have brethren who are masons and yet who are not Masons in the truest sense of the word. As Bro. Dudley Wright puts it: "They are the ones who think brotherhood means a small group or clique of their friends, to whom relief means grudgingly handing over a few coins after they have satisfied their own pleasures, and to whom truth means that which does not clash with their own preconceived opinions and prejudices".

My question is the following:

Are the Freemasonic moral values considered a secret when you are a Freemason? Because I try to apply the Freemasonic rules, as if I was a Freemason.

If they are not considered secrets, I will share and discuss them with other people I know, who are not Freemasons either.

Thank you a lot.


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## Elexir (Nov 18, 2020)

I would belive that this would be applied to most freemasonry. Number 4 is in the Swedish rite more tightly bound to christianity though.

And no you should not disscuss your wiew on masonic values with other non-masons when your not a freemason as you will give the impression to know more about freemasonry then you do.
You do not truly have a grasp on things until you are a freemason.

As a trick question: what is masonic ritual for?


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## johnvranos (Nov 18, 2020)

Elexir said:


> I would belive that this would be applied to most freemasonry. Number 4 is in the Swedish rite more tightly bound to christianity though.
> 
> And no you should not disscuss your wiew on masonic values with other non-masons when your not a freemason as you will give the impression to know more about freemasonry then you do.
> You do not truly have a grasp on things until you are a freemason.
> ...



Thank you for your reply.

I do not know much about masonic rituals, I only know they are secret.

Is discussion of freemasonic moral values a secret for freemasons?

Thank you a lot.


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## Elexir (Nov 18, 2020)

The rituals teach what the values are and how they are understood and used. Without ritual knowledge you dont know how masons use masonic values. So yes the deeper disscusion about the subject is secret since how they are thought and understood is secret


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## Bloke (Nov 18, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> Hello all,
> 
> I am not a Freemason, but I am interested in becoming one.
> 
> ...


Congratulations - I think you've done a pretty good job there..

There is the odd thing in what you have written that I would tweak, but you've obviously done some reading.



johnvranos said:


> .....If they are not considered secrets, I will share and discuss them with other people I know, who are not Freemasons either..



According to my local obligations and customs, they are not considered secret, but you can really only have a decent conversation about them in reference to the rituals of Freemasonry, which I am not going to do here on the internet..

If what you have written appeals to you, then I would contact local Freemasons and inquire about becoming a Freemason.


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## johnvranos (Nov 18, 2020)

Thank you all for your replies, you helped me a lot.



> If what you have written appeals to you, then I would contact local Freemasons and inquire about becoming a Freemason.



Yes, probably I will apply for Freemason sometime in the future.

Thank you all.


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## Winter (Nov 18, 2020)

Discussion of morals is never secret. Freemasonry is only one of countless systems that works to promote morality among its members.  I wouldn't even call them Masonic Morals. They are simply morals that anyone can apply to their life, whether a member of the Craft or not.  The only real secrets that Brothers would not discuss have to do with what we call the modes of recognition and some aspects of the initiation rituals. 

I'm curious that you'd want to share or discuss what you call Masonic morals with other non Masons. That comes off, to me anyway, as proselytizing. I may be reading your intent incorrectly though.  

But if our system appeals to you then, by all means, seek out your local Lodge and discuss the possibility of joining. Keep us informed of your progress and good luck.


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## johnvranos (Nov 18, 2020)

Winter said:


> I'm curious that you'd want to share or discuss what you call Masonic morals with other non Masons. That comes off, to me anyway, as proselytizing. I may be reading your intent incorrectly though.



I only talk to a couple of people very close to me, not everyone. But I will keep your advice in mind.



> But if our system appeals to you then, by all means, seek out your local Lodge and discuss the possibility of joining. Keep us informed of your progress and good luck.



Thank you. If I join Freemasonry, I will post in the forum.


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## Pointwithinacircle3 (Nov 18, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> The following is what I believe is a list of what modern Freemasons accept as basic beliefs of Masonic thought. This can be described as a system of belief and therefore an ethical system.


It is certainly true that Freemasonry can be seen as a system of thought, and therefore as a “system of belief”.  However, that is not how I see the Craft. To me Freemasonry is work. It is a thing you do. It is action. The morals and virtues that Freemasonry teaches are guides to that action. When a person takes action they receive a result. The results of a man’s actions are something that he must earn for himself, no one can give them to him. If a man acts virtuously these results may include dignity, self respect, and a sense of personal honor. I find it useful to have the support of a group of men as I endeavor to achieve these goals.


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## Winter (Nov 18, 2020)

Pointwithinacircle3 said:


> It is certainly true that Freemasonry can be seen as a system of thought, and therefore as a “system of belief”.  However, that is not how I see the Craft. To me Freemasonry is work. It is a thing you do. It is action. The morals and virtues that Freemasonry teaches are guides to that action. When a person takes action they receive a result. The results of a man’s actions are something that he must earn for himself, no one can give them to him. If a man acts virtuously these results may include dignity, self respect, and a sense of personal honor. I find it useful to have the support of a group of men as I endeavor to achieve these goals.



How do you reconcile that with the most common definition of Freemasonry that can be found virtually everywhere the Craft is discussed, "Freemasonry is a system of morality, veiled in allegory, and taught by symbols." Though I wholeheartedly agree that actions are louder than words.  Acta non Verba.


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## Pointwithinacircle3 (Nov 18, 2020)

Winter said:


> How do you reconcile that with the most common definition of Freemasonry that can be found virtually everywhere the Craft is discussed, "Freemasonry is a system of morality, veiled in allegory, and taught by symbols." Though I wholeheartedly agree that actions are louder than words.  Acta non Verba.


I see thoughts, feelings, and actions as circular in nature, each affecting the other two. Morality governs all three. I see no conflict.


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## johnvranos (Nov 18, 2020)

My history with Freemasonry began 2-3 months ago, when I decided to read more details about it online.

Now, I search for Masonic moral values online, learn them, and apply them.

Some of them are:

Faith, Hope and Charity

Brotherly Love, Relief and Truth

Virtue, Honour and Mercy


Since September, I have been donating a few money to "The smile of the child" organisation monthly.

https://www.hamogelo.gr/gr/en

Before I discover the Freemasonic moral values, I was not donating anything to anyone, although I had ethical values.

Also, I have given up some bad habits, like talking behind people's backs, or being a fan/enthusiast about something, and I do not discuss political topics with others to avoid conflicts, etc.

Freemasonry has improved me as a person already, without being a Freemason.


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## coachn (Nov 18, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> ...What then is considered unmasonic?


Unjustified incivility-disrespect-intolerance-inconsideration-hostility-etc...  When are such behaviors justified? When a life is on the line and the danger to it is unyielding to reason, respect, compassion, and consideration.


johnvranos said:


> ...Are the Freemasonic moral values considered a secret when you are a Freemason?


Nothing you have shared in your original post is secret.


Elexir said:


> ...what is [free]masonic ritual for?


To introduce men to Masonry.


johnvranos said:


> ...Is discussion of freemasonic moral values a secret for freemasons?


Nothing you have shared in your original post is secret.

BTW - Charity is a word translated from the Greek word "agape", which loosely translates to "unconditional love", not the giving om money, as it is now universally accepted to be.


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## otherstar (Nov 22, 2020)

coachn said:


> BTW - Charity is a word translated from the Greek word "agape", which loosely translates to "unconditional love", not the giving om money, as it is now universally accepted to be.



The concept yes (charity=agape). The actual word, no. Charity the word actually comes from it's Latin cognate, "caritas" (which also means love in the same sense as agape...agape has no direct English equivalent other than charity, which comes from caritas).


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## coachn (Nov 22, 2020)

otherstar said:


> The concept yes (charity=agape). The actual word, no. Charity the word actually comes from it's Latin cognate, "caritas" (which also means love in the same sense as agape...agape has no direct English equivalent other than charity, which comes from caritas).


Yes.  However, we are not talking about the original meaning here. We are talking about what most people take it to be today.

Unfortunately, as with many things well-intended, semantic drift has buried that original meaning under a mountain of superficial platitudes.  As a result, when the modern day individuals hear "charity", they have NO clue how that connects with agape. 

Charity today as a word has drifted in meaning to the point where it's unrecognizable with its original meaning.  Hence the warning in the bible about *giving without love*_.  Giving without love ain't the same thing as agape... AND  _in today's understanding, if you were to explain it, Unconditional love is totally different from what we understand today to be charity.

To drive home all these points, I prefer agape over charity and when it comes to referring to this in freemasonic circles, I throw in "unconditional love" so those who are listening will understand that it's NOT just forking over wallet notes.


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## johnvranos (Nov 22, 2020)

I do not know what you were taught by Freemasonry about the word agape, I am Greek, and "agape" means exactly "love" in modern Greek. Not unconditional love, or something else.

But, if you write something like "Agape", which is equivalent to "Love", you can  mean unconditional love, as in English.


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## Winter (Nov 22, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> I do not know what you were taught by Freemasonry about the word agape, I am Greek, and "agape" means exactly "love" in modern Greek. Not unconditional love, or something else.



Look up the ancient practice of the Agape, or Love Feasts, in the early centuries of the Christian church.


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## johnvranos (Nov 22, 2020)

Winter said:


> Look up the ancient practice of the Agape, or Love Feasts, in the early centuries of the Christian church.


I edited my post before seeing your reply. Yes, I do not know the subjects you mentioned, I only wrote about the modern word.


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## Winter (Nov 22, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> I edited my post before seeing your reply. Yes, I do not know the subjects you mentioned, I only wrote about the modern word.



Very understandable.  It will help your studies to remember that many of the concepts and even terminology are often rooted in ancient philosophies and may have very different connotations in the modern world.  This can often create confusion for someone just beginning to research.


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## johnvranos (Nov 22, 2020)

Yes. Thank you and Mr coachn for your replies.


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## coachn (Nov 22, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> I do not know what you were taught by Freemasonry about the word agape,...


As with most things offered by Freemasonic instruction, you'll get filtered and partial Light only.  Like a hyperlink, it's up to you to chase down the masonic rabbits intended to gain insight(s) into the EXTREMELY superficial offerings.


johnvranos said:


> ...I am Greek,


Yeah... and I'm American.  And although I have explored the meaning(s) offered up by foreign tongues, I have to ultimately investigate and understand it within the context of the times and culture the word was used within.  In this case, what I have offered up is enough information to allow serious students enough light to pursue the masonic rabbits further, should they truly desire to understand what's superficially offered up to them by the Craft.



johnvranos said:


> ...and "agape" means exactly "love" in modern Greek. Not unconditional love, or something else.


Yeah.. but we are NOT talking about "_modern Greek_", are we?



johnvranos said:


> But, if you write something like "Agape", which is equivalent to "Love", you can  mean unconditional love, as in English.


Yep. You're getting it. Kudos!

As with most things having to do with language(s), the modern day Greek usage is not the meaning assigned to it "way-back-when" and in the English of the day, and more specifically, by the original spin-meisters of Freemasonic Rituals who were doing there best to plant breadcrumb trails for the more serious members to pursue. 

Hence the clarification that I put forth. Pursue it further or don't.  Your choice.

"*Agape* (Ancient Greek ἀγάπη, _agapē_) is a Greco-Christian term referring to unconditional love, "the highest form of love, charity" and "the love of God for man and of man for God". The word is not to be confused with philia, brotherly love, or philautia, self-love, as it embraces a universal, unconditional love that transcends and persists regardless of circumstance. It goes beyond just the emotions to the extent of seeking the best for others. The noun form first occurs in the Septuagint, but the verb form goes as far back as Homer, translated literally as affection, as in "greet with affection" and "show affection for the dead". Other ancient authors have used forms of the word to denote love of a spouse or family, or affection for a particular activity, in contrast to eros (an affection of a sexual nature)." 
--  SOURCE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agape


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## johnvranos (Nov 22, 2020)

Interesting post. I do not know how to search for learning in depth, masonic moral values, as I am not a Freemason and I do not know the presentations and symbols used to learn these values.

I hope I will become one some day.

The following is what I am studying these days:



> *The Basic Principles of Freemasons*
> Freemasons have a set of basic principles that they all live by. Masonic lodge members promise never to bring anything offensive or defensive into the lodge with them — both weapons and words. The object of the lodge is to create a place where those divisions are left outside, so Masons can engage in activities that unite them instead of separating them:
> 
> 
> ...


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## coachn (Nov 22, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> Interesting post. I do not know how to search for learning in depth, masonic moral values, as I am not a Freemason and I do not know the presentations and symbols used to learn these values.
> 
> I hope I will become one some day.
> 
> The following is what I am studying these days:


As you study from the outside, keep in mind, much of what is written is by well meaning Brothers who write through the filter and by the biases of their own understanding.  Until you have been on the inside, you do not have the experience to know how to take what a Brother shares and contrast it with actual historical support, and do so to assure you don't blindly accept what is too often offered as conjecture based and religiously swayed opinion.


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## johnvranos (Nov 22, 2020)

coachn said:


> As you study from the outside, keep in mind, much of what is written is by well meaning Brothers who write through the filter and by the biases of their own understanding.  Until you have been on the inside, you do not have the experience to know how to take what a Brother shares and contrast it with actual historical support, and do so to assure you don't blindly accept what is too often offered as conjecture based and religiously swayed opinion.



OK, I understand that, what I read is the conclusions of some Freemasons.


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## coachn (Nov 22, 2020)

johnvranos said:


> OK, I understand that, what I read is the conclusions of some Freemasons.


Exactly!  Some of it's truly good stuff.  Others are good, but without further Craft experience, very misleading.  a few are downright off the rails and not accurate at all.


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## Winter (Nov 22, 2020)

coachn said:


> Exactly!  Some of it's truly good stuff.  Others are good, but without further Craft experience, very misleading.  a few are downright off the rails and not accurate at all.



Off the rails! This will be the name of my new Masonic podcast where we highlight the latest nonsense around the world in Freemasonry that week. lol


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## coachn (Nov 22, 2020)

Winter said:


> Off the rails! This will be the name of my new Masonic podcast where we highlight the latest nonsense around the world in Freemasonry that week. lol


Please!!!! Post the links!!!!


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