# The Ring



## Unique3rdEye (Oct 27, 2018)

Normally i see masonic rings on sale online or in jewlery shops and i was curious, if some one who is not apart of the Brotherhood or is about to become a mason or havent yet but bought a ring and wore it. Is that in any way a form of disrespect?

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## Bloke (Oct 27, 2018)

I would see it as a form of misrepresentation for someone who knew what is was..  
Would you wear a marine uniform if you were not a marine ? 
A medal you had not won ? 
A police uniform if you were not a policeman?
Many Freemasons would see a similar situation in someone wearing a symbol they were not entitled to wear and had not earned..


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## Warrior1256 (Oct 27, 2018)

Bloke said:


> I would see it as a form of misrepresentation for someone who knew what is was..
> Would you wear a marine uniform if you were not a marine ?
> A medal you had not won ?
> A police uniform if you were not a policeman?
> Many Freemasons would see a similar situation in someone wearing a symbol they were not entitled to wear and had not earned..


Ditto!


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## CLewey44 (Oct 27, 2018)

Just don't do it; especially if you plan on ever petitioning a lodge.


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## Lightlife (Oct 27, 2018)

Bloke said:


> I would see it as a form of misrepresentation for someone who knew what is was..
> Would you wear a marine uniform if you were not a marine ?
> A medal you had not won ?
> A police uniform if you were not a policeman?
> Many Freemasons would see a similar situation in someone wearing a symbol they were not entitled to wear and had not earned..



I agree.  I would add that many in Masonry consider the ring reserved for Master Masons and it is considered inappropriate for an Entered Apprentice or Fellowcraft to wear a ring.  Once, in my mother lodge,  a PM actually told (not asked) an EA with a ring to take it off


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## Unique3rdEye (Oct 27, 2018)

Thank you for the feedback. I honestly saw it from that point of view and at one point before had the intention of getting one seeing them in a jewelry store but as i got older i got wiser and im glad i didnt buy it because i know with in my heart you dont just buy a ring , using your example I cant just buy a badge and say im a police officer . So i find it rude when i see people wearing the ring and making fun of something they are absolutely clueless too.

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## Warrior1256 (Oct 27, 2018)

CLewey44 said:


> Just don't do it; especially if you plan on ever petitioning a lodge.


Good advice!


Lightlife said:


> I would add that many in Masonry consider the ring reserved for Master Masons and it is considered inappropriate for an Entered Apprentice or Fellowcraft to wear a ring.


That's the way it is in my jurisdiction.


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## David612 (Oct 28, 2018)

In my jurisdiction EAs and FC can wear the S&C and are infact encouraged too.


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## dfreybur (Oct 29, 2018)

Our symbols are earned so they should not be worn as a ring.  Of course if you will never be a member our approach does not apply to you, but it is definitely disrespectful.

If you have a loved one who earned his ring, it is respectful to wear it on a chain.  Or to add "In loving memory" to it.


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## Warrior1256 (Oct 29, 2018)

dfreybur said:


> Our symbols are earned so they should not be worn as a ring. Of course if you will never be a member our approach does not apply to you, but it is definitely disrespectful.


Agreed.


dfreybur said:


> If you have a loved one who earned his ring, it is respectful to wear it on a chain. Or to add "In loving memory" to it.


I can go along with this.


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## Winter (Oct 29, 2018)

dfreybur said:


> Our symbols are earned so they should not be worn as a ring.  Of course if you will never be a member our approach does not apply to you, but it is definitely disrespectful.
> 
> If you have a loved one who earned his ring, it is respectful to wear it on a chain.  Or to add "In loving memory" to it.


Would you apply the same thing to forum members using the S&C in their profile pic if they aren't Brothers? Because I have seen members on many forums who do that. 

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## David612 (Oct 30, 2018)

In my mind the S&C in the MM configuration is also the universally recognised for the fraternity as a whole as such any member can wear a pin or whatever to display that they are a mason


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## Lightlife (Oct 30, 2018)

David612 said:


> In my mind the S&C in the MM configuration is also the universally recognised for the fraternity as a whole as such any member can wear a pin or whatever to display that they are a mason



You make a good point.  If an EA were to wear and EA ring, I'd see no issue.  However, the situation I mentioned previously was an EA wearing a MM ring.


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## David612 (Oct 30, 2018)

I question the definition of whether it was a “Master Mason” ring or if it is infact rather just a “Masonic ring”
A bit loose but our buildings display the S&C and they aren’t master masons-



But buildings aren’t people, right guys?


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## Lightlife (Oct 30, 2018)

David612 said:


> I question the definition of whether it was a “Master Mason” ring or if it is infact rather just a “Masonic ring”



The definition is easy: the configuration of the S&C and, in some cases, the words "Master Mason" on the ring.


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## CLewey44 (Oct 30, 2018)

I'm sure there are EA/FC rings. I've seen their corresponding lapels.


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## Lightlife (Oct 30, 2018)

CLewey44 said:


> I'm sure there are EA/FC rings. I've seen their corresponding lapels.



Absolutely!  More common outside of the US where it takes more than a day to become a MM.


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## Warrior1256 (Oct 30, 2018)

Winter said:


> Would you apply the same thing to forum members using the S&C in their profile pic if they aren't Brothers?


Yes.


Lightlife said:


> If an EA were to wear and EA ring, I'd see no issue.


Same here.


CLewey44 said:


> I'm sure there are EA/FC rings. I've seen their corresponding lapels.


Yep.


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## Winter (Oct 30, 2018)

David612 said:


> I question the definition of whether it was a “Master Mason” ring or if it is infact rather just a “Masonic ring”
> A bit loose but our buildings display the S&C and they aren’t master masons-
> 
> 
> ...


I realize your comment is tongue in cheek, but marking a building where Master Masons (and their Apprentices and Fellows) gather with the sign of a Master Mason is not the same as a Brother wearing the emblem of a Master when they are not yet entitled to it.  

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## dfreybur (Oct 30, 2018)

Winter said:


> Would you apply the same thing to forum members using the S&C in their profile pic if they aren't Brothers? Because I have seen members on many forums who do that.



Wearing the S&C is *earned*.  If you haven't earned it, wearing it is disrespectful not only to us but also to the person doing it.

The question becomes whether any one use counts as wearing it.  I offered the example of carrying a ring on a chain as a memorial.  Generally including a symbol on your profile picture counts as wearing it.  To draw from another field it's "stolen honor" rather than "honoring principles".  If someone wants to honor our principles we have petitions for them.  But we aren't interested in dabblers.


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## CLewey44 (Oct 30, 2018)

Lightlife said:


> Absolutely!  More common outside of the US where it takes more than a day to become a MM.


I was actually about to mention that. They aren't popular here due to the fact that A. EAs/FCs rarely, if ever, go to stated meetings because they are mostly on the MM degree which certainly doesn't encourage the newer members to come to meetings and fellowship B. The amount of time you would wear it would be as little as a day but on average, what, maybe three months?


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## dfreybur (Oct 30, 2018)

CLewey44 said:


> I was actually about to mention that. They aren't popular here due to the fact that A. EAs/FCs rarely, if ever, go to stated meetings because they are mostly on the MM degree which certainly doesn't encourage the newer members to come to meetings and fellowship B. The amount of time you would wear it would be as little as a day but on average, what, maybe three months?



Yet we can wear it the rest of our lives.  I can wear my Shrine or Scottish Rite or Master Mason ring yet I mostly wear one of my PM rings.  We tend to wear the ring that means the most to us which is not always the one that represents our "highest" or "farthest" degree.


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## Lightlife (Oct 30, 2018)

dfreybur said:


> Yet we can wear it the rest of our lives.  I can wear my Shrine or Scottish Rite or Master Mason ring yet I mostly wear one of my PM rings.  We tend to wear the ring that means the most to us which is not always the one that represents our "highest" or "farthest" degree.



Yes.  I have many rings from different milestones but the one I wore (I no longer wear a Masonic ring) is a very plain, used, S&C ring.  I like the energy of a used and well worn ring Vs. a shiny new one.


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## CLewey44 (Oct 30, 2018)

dfreybur said:


> Yet we can wear it the rest of our lives.  I can wear my Shrine or Scottish Rite or Master Mason ring yet I mostly wear one of my PM rings.  We tend to wear the ring that means the most to us which is not always the one that represents our "highest" or "farthest" degree.


Very true, once an EA/FC, always such. Or at least you have the light of that degree.


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## Warrior1256 (Oct 30, 2018)

Winter said:


> I realize your comment is tongue in cheek, but marking a building where Master Masons (and their Apprentices and Fellows) gather with the sign of a Master Mason is not the same as a Brother wearing the emblem of a Master when they are not yet entitled to it.





dfreybur said:


> Wearing the S&C is *earned*. If you haven't earned it, wearing it is disrespectful not only to us but also to the person doing it.


Exactly!


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## David612 (Oct 30, 2018)

In some areas (i belive Japan is one) candidates are required to become involved with the lodge for up to a year prior to being initiated, they cook, clean, help with charitable works and so on but once initiated it can again take years to be raised to the sublime degree-
Other jurisdictions you can rock up one weekend and “earn” 32 degrees.

Earning it seems to be a bit of a sliding scale..


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## Winter (Oct 30, 2018)

David612 said:


> In some areas (i belive Japan is one) candidates are required to become involved with the lodge for up to a year prior to being initiated, they cook, clean, help with charitable works and so on but once initiated it can again take years to be raised to the sublime degree-
> Other jurisdictions you can rock up one weekend and “earn” 32 degrees.
> 
> Earning it seems to be a bit of a sliding scale..


True. But we can't think less of our Brothers who were raised in jurisdictions with shorter periods between degrees. Our Ob. is just as binding regardless if you spent 3 years going through the degrees or a weekend Man-to-Mason class. 

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## David612 (Oct 30, 2018)

Winter said:


> True. But we can't think less of our Brothers who were raised in jurisdictions with shorter periods between degrees. Our Ob. is just as binding regardless if you spent 3 years going through the degrees or a weekend Man-to-Mason class.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


Personally I don’t think less of them at all-
Just when this notion that any master masons has, by virtue of his rank, earned the right to wear an S&C I must disagree-
it’s simply reserved for masters in some jurisdictions, to claim its merit based is just a bit self-aggrandising.


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## Winter (Oct 30, 2018)

David612 said:


> Personally I don’t think less of them at all-
> Just when this notion that any master masons has, by virtue of his rank, earned the right to wear an S&C I must disagree-
> it’s simply reserved for masters in some jurisdictions, to claim its merit based is just a bit self-aggrandising.


The West gate isn't as guarded as it should be probably. But what is the measure to tell a Master Mason, "You haven't earned that ring."

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## David612 (Oct 30, 2018)

Winter said:


> The West gate isn't as guarded as it should be probably. But what is the measure to tell a Master Mason, "You haven't earned that ring."
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


I’m not surgesting that we tell masters to not wear a ring, rather I would encourage EA and FC to wear rings if they feel they wanted too, obviously PM rings and the like are different as they are quite specific but I’m firmly of the opinion the the S&C is the logo of the craft first and EA and FC are members of the craft.

That said there are of cause many masons who haven’t earned their rings, ranks or what have you but that isn’t their faults as they are candidates in this process- the fault becomes theirs if they don’t go back and learn and understand the work.


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## CLewey44 (Oct 30, 2018)

David612 said:


> In some areas (i belive Japan is one) candidates are required to become involved with the lodge for up to a year prior to being initiated, they cook, clean, help with charitable works and so on but once initiated it can again take years to be raised to the sublime degree-
> Other jurisdictions you can rock up one weekend and “earn” 32 degrees.
> 
> Earning it seems to be a bit of a sliding scale..



I'm a little torn on this sort of thing. I'm not sure it taking years and years to be a MM is the proper route.  This day and age, people are different. Numbers would certainly drop leaving only many, several dozen lodges left. But theyd be good lodges im sure. 

However, if one were that mentally invested in something (or fiscally with dues) they would be good, quality members vs. just paying $75.00 a year for a dues card and never even showing up in lodge. At that point it is like, what is the point of you even keeping your dues up? So you can have a masonic funeral?


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## David612 (Oct 30, 2018)

CLewey44 said:


> I'm a little torn on this sort of thing. I'm not sure it taking years and years to be a MM is the proper route.  This day and age, people are different. Numbers would certainly drop leaving only many, several dozen lodges left. But theyd be good lodges im sure.
> 
> However, if one were that mentally invested in something (or fiscally with dues) they would be good, quality members vs. just paying $75.00 a year for a dues card and never even showing up in lodge. At that point it is like, what is the point of you even keeping your dues up? So you can have a masonic funeral?


I don’t think there needs to be a time frame associated to doing the degrees really-
I guess it just comes down to when the candidate is actually proficient in the work-


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## CLewey44 (Oct 31, 2018)

David612 said:


> I don’t think there needs to be a time frame associated to doing the degrees really-
> I guess it just comes down to when the candidate is actually proficient in the work-



And that may be the difference in some places. Is proficiency in the work your ability to memorize something or is it the 'work' you've performed in your life, in lodge and elsewhere. But then I guess it'd be up to fellow lodge members to decide that. In other words, someone would have to make a notion to except and pass an EA to FC (for example) and maybe give reasons why. 

Technically, when cat lect is given, the brethren vote on whether or not the individual was 'proficient'. (Btw, I've never seen anyone get voted no, even when I was certain they would get declined on one particular occasion. The FC was basically just repeating back the answer the questioner was saying, yes you read that correctly, the questioner would read the question, pause and then more or less just give the answer and the guy was repeating him lol)Tough to say how to gauge proficiency outside of the cat lect but I'm sure it's done or could be done in some GLs.


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## Tpower31 (Jan 21, 2019)

Lightlife said:


> I agree.  I would add that many in Masonry consider the ring reserved for Master Masons and it is considered inappropriate for an Entered Apprentice or Fellowcraft to wear a ring.  Once, in my mother lodge,  a PM actually told (not asked) an EA with a ring to take it off



I agree I bought my ring as an EA but did not wear it until I was made a Master Mason as I felt I had not earned the right or privilege to wear it and only after I became a MM did I feel I was entitled to wear such a symbol and I wear it proudly


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## Warrior1256 (Jan 21, 2019)

Tpower31 said:


> I agree I bought my ring as an EA but did not wear it until I was made a Master Mason as I felt I had not earned the right or privilege to wear it and only after I became a MM did I feel I was entitled to wear such a symbol and I wear it proudly


Same here. I bought it as an EA but didn't wear it outdoors until I was an MM. I have to admit that I did sometimes wear it inside my home, lol.


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## David612 (Jan 21, 2019)

I picked up a ring after being raised- 
I regularly forget to wear it, especially to lodge.


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## Blackstar (Jan 21, 2019)

I had a student who came to school wearing the Square and Compasses on a "gold" dog tag and chain.  Nobody in the school was a Freemason, but me and another coworker had a conversation with him about why you just can't wear every symbol that looks cool.  He got it after we compared it to college fraternities and he never wore it to school again.


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## Rifleman1776 (Jan 23, 2019)

I  think the issue is petty. It is  matter of freedom of speech. In America, anyone can wear any symbol they wish at any time. Non-Masons wearing the s&c might be stupid but it is their right.


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## Blackstar (Jan 23, 2019)

Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences, though.


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## Winter (Jan 23, 2019)

Many states still have laws on the books that make it a misdemeanor punishable by fines or jail time to produce or wear a Masonic symbol when not entitled to it.  Though I doubt it has been actually prosecuted in anyone here's lifetime!

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## Warrior1256 (Jan 23, 2019)

Blackstar said:


> Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences, though.


Agreed. If you have not earned the right to wear a decoration or title I simply believe that it is deceptive and morally wrong to do so. Does a non-Mason have the legal right to wear the Square and Compasses symbol? Sure. Does he have a moral right to wear it? No, IMHO.


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## Rifleman1776 (Jan 25, 2019)

Winter said:


> Many states still have laws on the books that make it a misdemeanor punishable by fines or jail time to produce or wear a Masonic symbol when not entitled to it.  Though I doubt it has been actually prosecuted in anyone here's lifetime!
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk




That sounds like some kind of urban myth. Name one state with such laws please, I'll check it out.


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## Winter (Jan 25, 2019)

Rifleman1776 said:


> That sounds like some kind of urban myth. Name one state with such laws please, I'll check it out.


I do not post urban myths, Rifleman. I assure you it is a fact. My home jurisdiction of Wisconsin is one. The relavent state statute is even listed in the GLofWI education manual. Known as the "Green Book". I verified the statute was still on the books when I worked in LE in Wisconsin and was even able to find others still on the book.  I will be happy to post the statute when I get home from work. 

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## Winter (Jan 25, 2019)

Rifleman1776 said:


> That sounds like some kind of urban myth. Name one state with such laws please, I'll check it out.



Here is just one of the seven state statutes in Wisconsin still in effect that protect Freemasonry:

*132.17 Certain badges; penalty for unauthorized wearing. Any person who shall willfully wear the insignia, rosette, or badge or any imitation thereof, of Free Masons, or of any other society, order or organization operating under the lodge system, of ten years standing in the State of Wisconsin or of any duly incorporated fraternal... organization which willfully use the same to obtain aid or assistance thereby within this state, or shall willfully use the name of such society, order or organization, the titles of its officers, or its insignia, unless he shall be entitled to use or wear the same under the constitution, bylaws, rules and regulations thereof, shall be imprisoned not more than 30 days or fined not exceeding $20, or both. (October 1, 1989) *


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## Rifleman1776 (Jan 31, 2019)

Winter said:


> Here is just one of the seven state statutes in Wisconsin still in effect that protect Freemasonry:
> 
> *132.17 Certain badges; penalty for unauthorized wearing. Any person who shall willfully wear the insignia, rosette, or badge or any imitation thereof, of Free Masons, or of any other society, order or organization operating under the lodge system, of ten years standing in the State of Wisconsin or of any duly incorporated fraternal... organization which willfully use the same to obtain aid or assistance thereby within this state, or shall willfully use the name of such society, order or organization, the titles of its officers, or its insignia, unless he shall be entitled to use or wear the same under the constitution, bylaws, rules and regulations thereof, shall be imprisoned not more than 30 days or fined not exceeding $20, or both. (October 1, 1989) *




OK. They did it. But very bizarre.  I'm sure it would not hold up in courts. First Amendment and all that.


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## Brother JC (Jan 31, 2019)

Trademark laws and all that.


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## Warrior1256 (Jan 31, 2019)

Brother JC said:


> Trademark laws and all that.


Could very well apply.


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## Winter (Jan 31, 2019)

Rifleman1776 said:


> OK. They did it. But very bizarre.  I'm sure it would not hold up in courts. First Amendment and all that.



Wisconsin's protection of the use of our emblems is not unique. http://freemasonry.bcy.ca/grandlodge/trademark.html

Summary
1992 - Grand Lodge of Pennsylvania registered the square and compasses for their jurisdiction and the Masonic Service Association of North America sent a letter to all U.S. Grand Secretaries explaining that, as there is no U.S. masonic national authority, each Grand Lodge would have to register independently. (Unknown how many have registered at this time)

According to the Grand Lodge of Michigan Constitutions and By-Laws, Art. XXXI, 4-31 Sec. 2, any non-mason that uses the names and emblems (square and compasses) can be taken to court under the Michigan Annotated Statutes 18.641-18.647, 18-661-18.665, 18.671-18.675 and 18.691-18.692. For those freemasons that misuse the names and emblems, it is considered an unmasonic crime.

1994- Grand Lodge of Idaho registered the square and compasses, restricting its use in that state. A special agreement with the Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Oregon, which warrants Prince Hall lodges in Idaho, permits them to use it also.

The Grand Lodge of Scotland also has a copyright in place for the square and compasses incorporating the letter G.

1994 - Masonic Foundation of Ontario officially registered the Grand Lodge logo, the square and compasses with the letter G, with Consumer and Corporate Affairs.

2001 - New Zealand has registered the Mason's Mark.


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## David612 (Jan 31, 2019)

While it may be on the books what are the chances these are enforced?


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## Thomas Stright (Feb 1, 2019)

Rifleman1776 said:


> OK. They did it. But very bizarre.  I'm sure it would not hold up in courts. First Amendment and all that.



Not sure how the 1st would apply there...

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


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## Warrior1256 (Feb 1, 2019)

Winter said:


> 1992 - Grand Lodge of Pennsylvania registered the square and compasses for their jurisdiction and the Masonic Service Association of North America sent a letter to all U.S. Grand Secretaries explaining that, as there is no U.S. masonic national authority, each Grand Lodge would have to register independently. (Unknown how many have registered at this time)
> 
> According to the Grand Lodge of Michigan Constitutions and By-Laws, Art. XXXI, 4-31 Sec. 2, any non-mason that uses the names and emblems (square and compasses) can be taken to court under the Michigan Annotated Statutes 18.641-18.647, 18-661-18.665, 18.671-18.675 and 18.691-18.692. For those freemasons that misuse the names and emblems, it is considered an unmasonic crime.
> 
> ...


Interesting info Brother Winter...thanks!


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## Brother JC (Feb 1, 2019)

Thomas Stright said:


> Not sure how the 1st would apply there...
> 
> Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.



Exactly. “Congress shall not...” States can make laws protecting such things, and do regularly.


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