# Codebooks for Non-Master Masons



## Blake Bowden (Dec 23, 2008)

Should EA's and FC's be allowed to use a Codebook for their respective degrees? For example, if you are working on your EA degree, you would get an "EA" chapter from a codebook. Thoughts...


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## jonesvilletexas (Dec 23, 2008)

I for one do not belive in code books at all.


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## jwardl (Dec 24, 2008)

Mouth to ear requires their attendance, their involvement.
Anyone can read a book.


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## rhitland (Dec 24, 2008)

To me codes books are like ice, some cannot drink their cocktail without it, many swear it waters the drink down and ruins the flavor, while others could careless, they realize the same thing happens in the end no matter if you use ice or not. lol


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## nick1368 (Dec 24, 2008)

I don't think they should have one...it should be from mouth to ear.  Learning it from mouth to ear with a well versed brother not only makes the newly made brother attentative to learning but it builds a special relation between an "older" Brother and a "new" Brother.  With that being said, I don't see anything wrong with having a "little" brother.  Unfortunetly, with our lives being so busy it is difficult at times to get with a Brother to learn the work.  Of course you need to the expericd Brother to brush up on what you have learned from the "little" brother


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## Jon D. Smith (Jan 28, 2009)

I did not use one and, I knew they were out there. 
I waited until I was 44 years of age to join, I wanted to make sure I gave the organization the proper respect. My Grandfather was a Mason and I respected that man very very much. 
To me, I would have felt him looking down at me for above if I would have even attempted to go at it anyway other than the right way.
That's just my feelings though...


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## fairbanks1363pm (Feb 16, 2009)

I think it would benifit the candidate when he is not with the instructor and is able to go over his work on his own.  i do agree its very important to meet and work from mouth to ear.


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## Robert Marshall (Feb 16, 2009)

My vote may not be considered valid, but I was entered just last month, so I am still an EA. As such, I don't like the idea of learning the work in any way other than "mouth to ear." It's a good way to reaffirm the necessary dependence upon a Brother when in need. If a Brother is willing to take his time to teach you, why learn from a lifeless book?


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## Robert Marshall (Feb 16, 2009)

Jon D. Smith said:


> I did not use one and, I knew they were out there.
> I waited until I was 44 years of age to join, I wanted to make sure I gave the organization the proper respect. My Grandfather was a Mason and I respected that man very very much.
> To me, I would have felt him looking down at me for above if I would have even attempted to go at it anyway other than the right way.
> That's just my feelings though...



These are my feelings exactly. This could have been a post from me except for the age, and in my case, it was a great-grandfather. Well said, Jon.


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## Joey (Feb 16, 2009)

Longhorn1rob said:


> These are my feelings exactly. This could have been a post from me except for the age, and in my case, it was a great-grandfather. Well said, Jon.





Jon D. Smith said:


> I did not use one and, I knew they were out there.
> I waited until I was 44 years of age to join, I wanted to make sure I gave the organization the proper respect. My Grandfather was a Mason and I respected that man very very much.
> To me, I would have felt him looking down at me for above if I would have even attempted to go at it anyway other than the right way.
> That's just my feelings though...





nick1368 said:


> I don't think they should have one...it should be from mouth to ear.  Learning it from mouth to ear with a well versed brother not only makes the newly made brother attentative to learning but it builds a special relation between an "older" Brother and a "new" Brother.  With that being said, I don't see anything wrong with having a "little" brother.  Unfortunetly, with our lives being so busy it is difficult at times to get with a Brother to learn the work.  Of course you need to the expericd Brother to brush up on what you have learned from the "little" brother



I agree with all of you with one exception...... In my case: my instructor left for summer vacation to New Mexico. I was moved to another instructor who was with in a matter of 2 weeks called to active duty in the Army...... That was the only two that were available at the time......What should I have done? And, should somebody else find themselves in such a situation what should they do?


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## Robert Marshall (Feb 16, 2009)

Joey, if you check my original post, I did allow for the lack of an instructor. "If a Brother is willing.." Yes, in your case, it is understandable. If I had been you, I likely would have looked for a book, or possibly traveled to the next closest Lodge.


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## bchandlerfinch (Feb 26, 2009)

having a codebook as an ea and fc has allowed me to learn the work at a much faster and more in-depth rate.  Because of learning it through a combination of oral and reading  (75% oral, 25% reading), I have been able to spend a greater amount of time exploring the deeper meanings of the work while progressing.   I have also been able to learn both sides of the examination.   This will help me when it is my turn to be the "Big" brother.  In my case I initially purchased the book because I was teaching 4 nights a week and didn't know when I would be able to meet with anyone.      After my job ended it became necessary for me to finish my memory work because I reenlisted into the army and will be going to AIT very soon, and want to finish my work before I ship.


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## jonesvilletexas (Feb 26, 2009)

My brother you might read the Grand Lodge Law concerning the use of a code book and the position bv a EA, FC or MM in the use of learning there work.


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## Ben Rodriguez (Feb 27, 2009)

I was encouraged by my teacher to purchase a copy of the book, we study mouth to ear with no book, however, I take my own time for study and review reading the codes, this has helped me quite a bit more, language wise. I have learned some new terms from the work, my situation being that English is my second language. I respect your opinion on not using the book as well, but the most important thing is that we possess the work, stored mentally. Making us better men to serve our society.

I turned in my first section of the proficiency last night! *dances* So I'm happy about that as well!


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## Magistri Comacino (Mar 5, 2009)

Personally, I would like to see the code book divided into EA, FC and MM sections - including the cathechism, opening & closing, etc. 

There will always be a wide range of varying levels of interest, desire and motivation to study and learn. 

There is also a wide range of varying levels of patience, mentoring ability, and an ability to instill interest and curiosity in Masonic teachings. 

If an EA of any age has a teacher who is truly interested in him, that EA (or FC) will gravitate to that Masonic Friend & Brother, whether or not that EA has access to a code book. That is at the core of who we are and the universal attractiveness - Brothers forming lifelong bonds. 

If the only ones in your Lodge who know the work well enough to teach it are sharp-tongued, petty and complaining old task-masters, it would be better to issue all the EAs a codebook with their EA cards. And yes, I know the law would have to be changed to allow that - but you get my point. 


"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing." ~~ Albert Einstein

.


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## 4thgenPM (Mar 5, 2009)

Gentlemen, this forum seems to be taking shape along the same lines that we have seen this debate go in the last few years when it is brought up at Grand Lodge, Wardens Retreats, and other events...those in the larger Lodges with hundreds of members and sevaral available instructors hold hard and fast to the belief that the codebooks should not be allowed.  Those in the rural Lodges, which are usually around 75 members or less, who have one or two qualified instructors tend to agree with the existence and use of the book.  

Last night I assisted my home Lodge with 2 EA degrees.  They are trying to have weekly practice nights to improve the quality of their work as it has deteriorated over the past ten years.  Unfortunately, all of the men who hold A or B certificates in that District live over 2 hours away (outside the District).  These Brethren need the assistance of both a knowledgeable Brother and the codebook to assist them in maintaining the quality of work.  While I'm almost certain that some of them have books after the work I witnessed last night, I am confident that they would not condone giving one to an EA, FC or even a MM who hasn't completed his proficiency.  

Long story short, the issue of a codebook is both a personal and a situational decision.  Lodges and Masons should allow this issue to be decided on a local level and not insert their own situation into another's.

Christian D. Moore, PM


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## jonesvilletexas (Mar 5, 2009)

I wonder what the reaction will be when a DDGM finds a code book in the lodge and reports the brother to the GM? You know it is just a matter of time, I have seen them in use in a number of lodges.


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## gortex6 (Mar 5, 2009)

From what I hear, the old Arabia Shrine Center off Brompton sold codebooks out of their storefront display case.


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## 4thgenPM (Mar 6, 2009)

jonesvilletexas said:


> I wonder what the reaction will be when a DDGM finds a code book in the lodge and reports the brother to the GM? You know it is just a matter of time, I have seen them in use in a number of lodges.




I have also seen one used (by an EA who purchased it online) in a Lodge room.  The officers immediately noticed what it was and removed it.  They then counseled with him privately after the meeting regarding the rules and moved on.  I was just visiting the Lodge that night, so I'm not sure if any further action was taken or if the Brother is still working, but I felt that it was handled appropriately at the time and was proud of the Brethren using it as an educational opportunity instead of making a "mountain out of a mole hill" in that situation.  Obviously, each situation will be different and will require a different reaction.

Christian D. Moore, PM


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## jwardl (Mar 6, 2009)

gortex6 said:


> From what I hear, the old Arabia Shrine Center off Brompton sold codebooks out of their storefront display case.



Perhaps... not being a tiled blue lodge, they could do that.


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## jwardl (Mar 6, 2009)

Magistri Comacino said:


> Personally, I would like to see the code book divided into EA, FC and MM sections - including the cathechism, opening & closing, etc.



It already is -- or do you mean separate volumes (covers)?


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## gortex6 (Mar 21, 2009)

jwardl said:


> Perhaps... not being a tiled blue lodge, they could do that.



A couple blue lodges had used that building too!


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## JTM (Mar 21, 2009)

codebooks are silly, in my opinion.  they aren't even correct most of the time... haven't been updated enough (since 82-84)


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## 4thgenPM (Jul 6, 2009)

Brethren, as with many other things in Masonry today this post reminds me of the story of the chicken and the pig wo decided to make breakfast for all of the other animals on the farm.  The chicken wanted to serve a traditional farmer's breakfast of bacon and eggs.  The pig wasn't as enthused because of the different level of commitment involved.  By providing the eggs, the chicken was involved with preparing the meal, but in providing the bacon the pig would have to be totally committed...

So, the question must be answered of whether or not we want our newest Brothers to simply be involved with Masonry when it is convenient for them by providing a codebook or do we want them committed to the ideals and traditions of the Fraternity?  As with everything there will be exceptions but the new Brother who attempts to learn his work from a codebook will not have the commitment to other activities that will inherently develop in the relationships formed while learning in the traditional manner.

Also, how would you expect the Brother to learn the work correctly if he can't ready the codebook? I've got a copy of the most widely used one...it is full of mistakes and you have to know the work to know what the code is supposed to represent.  

The last thing I would ask is this...who is going to make the young Brother feel better when he memorizes the work from the book perfectly and something is said about his mistakes later (and I promise you that it only takes about 30 seconds to know that someone is doing "book work.")?


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## RedTemplar (Jul 20, 2009)

Brethren, I agree whole-heartedly that nothing replaces one-to-one instruction for all the reasons discussed here.  My question is, in today's world of instant communication, if anyone can download any lecture from the internet why can't we use written material for educational purposes? The cat has been let out of the bag long ago, so to speak.


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## owls84 (Jul 21, 2009)

Good Rebuttal Bro. RT. I just think that the instruction should be treated as a testimony to the commitment from the new brother. I was even handed copies of the work in MS Word but I just destroyed each one. I felt that it was the least I could do. I don't know I just took it a little more serious maybe. I will say that the second and third section of my EA could have used a little more work in my opinion.


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## HKTidwell (Aug 20, 2009)

Alright as to smaller lodges not as many instructors, typically these have older brethren who know the work but need to brush up on it.  When I was learning my work I had one brother who would come by for lunch every time there was a chance.  However if I was at lodge on practice night I would draw from a pool of guys.  No offense but these older gentleman who may not be 100% proficient in the work were some of the best instructors.  They didn't use a book but they could figure it out.  Perhaps we need more of the older brethren to be asked to help.  When I would ask they would help but because they knew, they were not 100% up on the work they hesitated until being asked. Mouth to Ear rocks!  

I found not only did I have a unique bond to one brother but with many other brethren.  This is part of the process that helps for a lasting bond.  We should not throw this bond out, it should be nourished and encouraged.  Also I'm sure that if there is a lodge that is lacking in instructors they should not be hesitant in asking other brothers from different lodges to help.  I'm pretty sure somebody would be willing to help.  

I see a use for the code books in brushing up on memory work but I do not think it should be used for instructing or learning.


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## Wingnut (Aug 20, 2009)

I havent heard of anyone using the book to replace one on one or even group training, but more as an aid to the memory (I seem to have read that somewhere)...


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## Bill Lins (Aug 20, 2009)

owls84 said:


> I was even handed copies of the work in MS Word.


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## HKTidwell (Jan 5, 2010)

When I was considering joining, I read a blog about Masonry in Canada and one of the things mentioned is they are given everything written down.  I knew this wasn't true in Texas based on conversations I had with Masons.  However there are a lot of things as I have found out that based upon Grand lodge Jurisdiction varies.  A lot of things I'm kinda glad Texas does the way it does, there are some I think need to change.


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## JEbeling (Jan 6, 2010)

I am for whatever it takes to get the EA - FC thru to becoming a Master Mason... ! I think after being a Master for a while they seem to work themself into lodge where they fit best... ! some are great at the work... orther are great stewarts.. others are great fund raisers.. ! I think we each have a tallent that we bring to masonary.. ! and it's not all the same.. !


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## Smokey613 (Jan 7, 2010)

This brings to mind a quote "Each according to his gifts". This is how I feel we should view our involvement in Masonry.


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## MGM357 (Jan 7, 2010)

4thgenPM said:


> Brethren, as with many other things in Masonry today this post reminds me of the story of the chicken and the pig wo decided to make breakfast for all of the other animals on the farm.  The chicken wanted to serve a traditional farmer's breakfast of bacon and eggs.  The pig wasn't as enthused because of the different level of commitment involved.  By providing the eggs, the chicken was involved with preparing the meal, but in providing the bacon the pig would have to be totally committed...
> 
> So, the question must be answered of whether or not we want our newest Brothers to simply be involved with Masonry when it is convenient for them by providing a codebook or do we want them committed to the ideals and traditions of the Fraternity?  As with everything there will be exceptions but the new Brother who attempts to learn his work from a codebook will not have the commitment to other activities that will inherently develop in the relationships formed while learning in the traditional manner.
> 
> ...


 
Well said!!! 
As far as I know there were no code books around when I learned all of my work (1992). I wasn't involved with Masonry for a long time. When I finally started to come back to the Lodge, I noticed how much was stilled stored in my repository. I joined the York Rite almost a year ago. After joining I was given rituals, I can tell you, it's harder for me to learn the work. 

Today's world, everything has to happen right this very micro second. The information highway is at our fingertips. It would be nice if we would slow down for Masonry.


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## js4253 (Jan 8, 2010)

King Solomon and his followers has been around for a long time and a majority of Texas Masons own one.  But that is a secret.  Don't tell anyone.


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## Smokey613 (Jan 8, 2010)

When I was initiated in 1987 and started learning my work there may have been a code book but no one said anything about it. I learned the "old" way. There were no dues card issued to me and no real interaction with the lodge. My only contact with the lodge was through my instructor and the brother I originally requested the petition from. Life got hectic and I fell through the cracks before I could turn my work  in. Long story short, it took me 19 years before I was raised. I am very glad I decided to pick up where I left off. I will say, even with having learned the EA work completely 19 years earlier I was surprised how much stuck when I resumed years later. I credit my success to my excellent instructor who talked me into getting back involved with Masonry.


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## HKTidwell (Jan 8, 2010)

Smokey613 said:


> When I was initiated in 1987 and started learning my work there may have been a code book but no one said anything about it. I learned the "old" way. There were no dues card issued to me and no real interaction with the lodge. My only contact with the lodge was through my instructor and the brother I originally requested the petition from. Life got hectic and I fell through the cracks before I could turn my work  in. Long story short, it took me 19 years before I was raised. I am very glad I decided to pick up where I left off. I will say, even with having learned the EA work completely 19 years earlier I was surprised how much stuck when I resumed years later. I credit my success to my excellent instructor who talked me into getting back involved with Masonry.


 
What was the process for turning in the work after so long?  I keep meaning to ask at lodge how a person goes about doing this.   Did you have to Pay dues for 19 years, was it a vote and did you do your work at the same place you applied?


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## Smokey613 (Jan 8, 2010)

I went back to the same lodge I originally petitioned, the same one I am still with. My instructor contacted the WM at the time. I  had to pay 2 years back dues, petition again and they assigned an investigating committee. Then they voted on me.  Due to having to wait between meetings, the normal wait period between degrees and other delays, it took me almost 4 months before I turned in my MM work. The rest the say is history.


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## B.Eddlemon (Jan 8, 2010)

Just as the inside cover of the book speak about it being a aid to memory, I think if it is use it should only be used for that. I had access to one during my EA and could only understand the work that my instructor and I had already gone over. Sure you pick up bits and peices but the mouth to ear is the only way to get the complete knowledge of it. The book cant help you when your stumped like an instructor nor can it explain the different meanings of items that might need an explination. I learned alot more alot faster by mouth to ear than the short time I had the book.


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## MGM357 (Jan 8, 2010)

js4253 said:


> King Solomon and his followers has been around for a long time and a majority of Texas Masons own one.  But that is a secret.  Don't tell anyone.



I guess I'm not part of the majority. I do own a monitor. I got it after I was raised. I don't think a monitor is any where near to a cypher book.


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## Bill Lins (Jan 9, 2010)

Smokey613 said:


> I  had to pay 2 years back dues, petition again and they assigned an investigating committee. Then they voted on me.


 
Smokey- if I understood you correctly, you were initiated & then waited 19 years before learning & turning in your EA work? If so, you should not have been charged anything. Only Master Masons are obliged to pay dues. After you turned your EA work in, you should have petitioned for advancement and, if requested by any member of the Lodge, been investigated before the Lodge voted on your advancement, but there shouldn't have been any charge except for the FC & MM degree fees as they were, in turn, conferred.


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## Smokey613 (Jan 9, 2010)

Bill you are correct. I got to thinking about it after I replied but decided to just let it lay. I only had to pay for my FC and MM degrees. Also, I did learn my EA work but when I was scheduled to turn it in there was some kind of "issue" going on with the lodge and they postponed it. By the time that blew over, I had lost interest and said to heck with it. I decided I did not want any part of Masonry. Glad I changed my mind 19 years later.


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## jwhoff (Dec 21, 2010)

Hopefully this one is settled.  Hopefully!


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## JTM (Jan 1, 2011)

This thread is from 08.  It's now 11.  If you'd like to discuss codebooks, please start a new thread.


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## mrmarcust (Jan 9, 2011)

rhitland said:
			
		

> To me codes books are like ice, some cannot drink their cocktail without it, many swear it waters the drink down and ruins the flavor, while others could careless, they realize the same thing happens in the end no matter if you use ice or not. lol



I agree with this thought process. But understand why not on many levels to allow a code book. But mouth to ear is great for two people that spend a lot of time together and can work on work while at work.  In today's busy world, it isn't an option all the time. But if all someone could rely on was a book, how much is lost in the translation?  It truly is a duel edge sword.

Not only does the mouth have to be available (which is great if they are retired our rich and don't work... Haha) but so does the ear.  Some ears work a lot of hours our work at night on shift alone while everyone else sleeps. And this is a greater number than some realize.  I believe in the older ways, but times have changed.  We have to allow for that. Not to rid ourselves of the older customs, but adapt to meet our very own demands. I wouldn't mind seeing an EA and FC code book.  Use it as a supplement and still use mouth to ear to practice and to gain understanding.  Because you won't get that from a book. Knowledge is learning it but wisdom is working it and applying knowledge.  Are we suppose to be helping make others wiser? They could seek the knowledge on their own.


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## mark! (Jan 10, 2011)

JTM said:


> This thread is from 08. It's now 11. If you'd like to discuss codebooks, please start a new thread.



I'm gonna go ahead and close this thread, as stated above brothers, if you'd like discuss codebooks, please start a new thread up for discussion.  Thanks.


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