# Best Chapeaus



## Companion Joe (Oct 14, 2014)

Does anyone have an opinion on what is the best chapeau available, balancing quality and price?

My chapeau is an antique model I bought off ebay. I will be moving closer to commander next year, so I figured I should break down and buy a nice one. I have had a tendency throughout my life to try to go low dollar and buy some cheap POS only to wind up going back later and spending the money I should have spent in the first place, ultimately costing myself more than if I had just bought nice originally.

I am trying not to do that this time. Several outlets I have found online have some for $300, but a few of the guys in my Commandery have them, and I don't like the looks. They appear odd with a very flat bottom surface and more or less rounded sides.

I like the looks of the chapeaus from New London Regalia. It would wind up about $400+. My knee jerk self screams to go low ball, but my sensible side is saying don't quibble over $100 for what I am hoping is a once in a lifetime purchase.

Does anyone have any opinions on the New London chapeaus or any other places to look? I am by nature a tightwad, so spending that much on something sight unseen that can't be returned just unnerves me!


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## Paul E. Wunsche (Oct 15, 2014)

K T Universal - Chapeaus - approx. cost $ 235.00 plus S&H Phil Boley is the owner, he is a Past Grand Commander of Kansas and an affiliated Past Grand Commander of Texas.  He has a good product at a good cost.  I know several Sir Knights who have purchased through him and were very satisfied.  Also, if you purchase a silver chapeaus, then when you become Commander send it back to him and for a reasonable price he will upgrade it to gold.


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## Rifleman1776 (Nov 8, 2014)

$200.00 to $400.00 for a hat?  And we wonder why it is hard to attract new members to any fraternity.  Before I demited out of York Rite I was once told not to come to a Commandery meeting because I did not have a uniform. If they didn't want me because I did not have so-called proper clothes, I didn't need them.  Sorry for the attitude but this was a big dissapointment. I now devote my time to my lodge and Shrine club. They accept me as I am for who I am.


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## Pscyclepath (Nov 8, 2014)

Rifleman1776 said:


> $200.00 to $400.00 for a hat?  And we wonder why it is hard to attract new members to any fraternity.  Before I demited out of York Rite I was once told not to come to a Commandery meeting because I did not have a uniform. If they didn't want me because I did not have so-called proper clothes, I didn't need them.  Sorry for the attitude but this was a big dissapointment. I now devote my time to my lodge and Shrine club. They accept me as I am for who I am.



I ran into about the same sort of thing...  Got the class A uniform, sword, & belt to get started, but then ran afoul of some of the uniform nazis, so I never did drop the bucks on a chapeau or the other hat.  Haven't been back to meeting yet either...  My time goes to my blue lodge and the Scottish Rite, with what's left over going to my RA chapter as I can fit it in.   This year and the next two I will be going thru the principal offices in lodge, so won't have a whole lot of time to go to my appendant groups other than maybe AASR...


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## RyanC (Nov 8, 2014)

First let me say sorry about hijacking the post. I find it crazy that any group would be that crazy about out dated uniforms, this why many don't join a appendant bodies. I thought is was to gain more light, not look like captain crunch.


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## Paul E. Wunsche (Nov 8, 2014)

Wow, I am so sorry that you were treated that way.  In the Commanderies I belong to we except you as you are and try to help you find what you need for a uniform.  The only time that we are sticklers is when it comes time for Grand Commandery or Grand Encampment drill competition.  As far as the cost of a new chapeau  being high, if you are Worshipful Master a good felt hat cost over $300.00 and a good straw hat cost around $75.00 to a $150.00.  For those who dropped out of Commandery please give us another chance, I hope that their mentality has changed for the good of our fraternity.


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## Companion Joe (Nov 9, 2014)

I, too, am sorry to hear you were treated that way. Just yesterday, we conferred the Order of the Temple on four new Sir Knights. I told them explicitly that they do not have to have uniforms to attend meetings, and that most Commanderies have loaner items to help get them started.

I also agree that I am not a fan of the uniforms, but it is what it is. You either want to participate, or you don't. Every man has that choice. I'd love to see us get something more in line with what a Templar uniform might have actually looked like, but I don't see it happening. There is an impasse between those who have bought their stuff over the years and shouldn't be asked to buy something different and those who don't want to purchase the current uniform. 

As for people talking about "outdated" stuff, that's where I have to say I don't agree. The greatest part about all of Freemasonry is that it is a throwback to an earlier time. My current Commandery uniform jacket has the name of a long-dead Sir Knight and the date of manufacture stitched in it is 8/26/61. I benefitted from getting his jacket. Another man has his sword. It's a way to remember those men. I actually have a pretty nice sword with my name and Commandery engraved on it. My hope of hopes is that sometime in the future, someone will be using it and remember me.


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## Companion Joe (Nov 9, 2014)

Rifleman: How much did you pay for that fez? A high end fez will run you close to $300, so what's the difference?


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## Rifleman1776 (Nov 9, 2014)

Joe, my original fez was included in my initiation fees. Today it would be about $70.00. The one in the picture belonged to a friend who passed. Many families donate clothes, fez, etc. to my Shrine Club. We have dozens of fez and jackets available to those who can use them. However, I have never seen a Shriner turned away from any event for not wearing his fez. Some clubs impose a 'fine' ranging from 25 cents to a dollar for a member forgetting to bring his. Not bad considering the money goes to help support the Shrine Childrens hospitals.


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## Brother JC (Nov 9, 2014)

I attended an Easter service one year in a black suit with my Malta medal. I was unsure of what anyone would say about the lack of a uniform. The Grand Commander tapped my medal and told me not to worry, as I was wearing the only required piece of regalia.
I'll keep my opinion if the Civil War uniforms to myself in this thread, as I've already posted them in the past.


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## Companion Joe (Nov 9, 2014)

Rifleman1776 said:


> Joe, my original fez was included in my initiation fees. Today it would be about $70.00. The one in the picture belonged to a friend who passed. Many families donate clothes, fez, etc. to my Shrine Club. We have dozens of fez and jackets available to those who can use them. However, I have never seen a Shriner turned away from any event for not wearing his fez. Some clubs impose a 'fine' ranging from 25 cents to a dollar for a member forgetting to bring his. Not bad considering the money goes to help support the Shrine Childrens hospitals.



That's the same with most Commanderies. My jacket and sword belt both belonged to men who have passed, and they were donated by their families. Most Commanderies have items available. I have never seen a member turned away for not having a uniform. We have many guys who come without a uniform. The only requirement is if you are going to be an officer, then you need a uniform.


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## Rifleman1776 (Nov 12, 2014)

Joe, I was turned away. Had I been allowed to attend a meeting of the Commandery I belonged to I might have learned this. But, I was denied an opportunity to even commiserate with Brother KT's. That event was a major reason I eventually decided to demit out of York Rite entirely. Yesterday at our local Veteran's Day observance a number of Shriners all sat together. Not planned, just friends. I have not experienced this kind of comaraderie in Arkansas Masonry. It does exist in Missouri Masonry where I now have my lodge membership.


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## crono782 (Nov 12, 2014)

I think you happened upon an especially bad apple Commandery. Here, you only need the uniform if you're an officer. All Sir Knights are welcome at our meetings.


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## Paul E. Wunsche (Nov 12, 2014)

Companion Joe said:


> That's the same with most Commanderies. My jacket and sword belt both belonged to men who have passed, and they were donated by their families. Most Commanderies have items available. I have never seen a member turned away for not having a uniform. We have many guys who come without a uniform. The only requirement is if you are going to be an officer, then you need a uniform.


I received my first "Brand new chapeau" as a gift when I became a PCG.  My first "Brand new uniform" was when I was elected Grand Sentinel.  We could not survive without the "used stuff"


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## Companion Joe (Nov 12, 2014)

Rifleman1776 said:


> Joe, I was turned away. Had I been allowed to attend a meeting of the Commandery I belonged to I might have learned this. But, I was denied an opportunity to even commiserate with Brother KT's. That event was a major reason I eventually decided to demit out of York Rite entirely. Yesterday at our local Veteran's Day observance a number of Shriners all sat together. Not planned, just friends. I have not experienced this kind of comaraderie in Arkansas Masonry. It does exist in Missouri Masonry where I now have my lodge membership.



If you were turned away, that must have been an individual Commandery thing. I have never seen or hear tell of anyone around here being turned away.


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## SirKnightMatthew (Dec 10, 2014)

Paul E. Wunsche said:


> K T Universal - Chapeaus - approx. cost $ 235.00 plus S&H Phil Boley is the owner, he is a Past Grand Commander of Kansas and an affiliated Past Grand Commander of Texas.  He has a good product at a good cost.  I know several Sir Knights who have purchased through him and were very satisfied.  Also, if you purchase a silver chapeaus, then when you become Commander send it back to him and for a reasonable price he will upgrade it to gold.




Hello, I am a newly made Templar Knight in Pennsylvania. I was speaking to Sir Phil on November 19th via email when all communications suddenly dropped. I called and left a few messages with no reply. Have you any way of knowing if he is okay? Two other Sir Knights and myself wanted to place orders for a Chapeau with him and are worried something happen to him from lack of communication. 
I don't have any other way of contacting him besides the website but all contacts there harbor no reply when once there was.


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## Willaim Perkins (Dec 11, 2014)

Until we can phase it out, go with the cheapest you feel comfortable wearing.


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## Willaim Perkins (Dec 11, 2014)

Rifleman1776 said:


> $200.00 to $400.00 for a hat?  And we wonder why it is hard to attract new members to any fraternity.  Before I demited out of York Rite I was once told not to come to a Commandery meeting because I did not have a uniform. If they didn't want me because I did not have so-called proper clothes, I didn't need them.  Sorry for the attitude but this was a big dissapointment. I now devote my time to my lodge and Shrine club. They accept me as I am for who I am.


I don't believe a uniform should be required to attend meetings, we don't require it.  To hold an office we'd like for you to be in uniform.  I want to drastically change the uniform resulting in a considerable savings.


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## SirKnightMatthew (Jan 9, 2015)

Willaim Perkins said:


> I don't believe a uniform should be required to attend meetings, we don't require it.  To hold an office we'd like for you to be in uniform.  I want to drastically change the uniform resulting in a considerable savings.


Don't you think reducing the uniform will take away from what makes it special? I personally like the uniform and think that it's seriously plain looking already considering how sharp is looked in it's hay day with the frocks and what not. I am in Pennsylvania and we have some of the most boring (if not the most) in the United States. I will admit that getting my uniform has nickle and dime'd me to death but that is only because I was fussy about certain things, things as simple are paying more for a chapeau just to have an arch in it, but that's me. To bad it is not the glory days, I read a lot about how it was and things seem seriously watered down. That makes me sad.


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## Willaim Perkins (Jan 9, 2015)

SirKnightMatthew said:


> Don't you think reducing the uniform will take away from what makes it special? I personally like the uniform and think that it's seriously plain looking already considering how sharp is looked in it's hay day with the frocks and what not. I am in Pennsylvania and we have some of the most boring (if not the most) in the United States. I will admit that getting my uniform has nickle and dime'd me to death but that is only because I was fussy about certain things, things as simple are paying more for a chapeau just to have an arch in it, but that's me. To bad it is not the glory days, I read a lot about how it was and things seem seriously watered down. That makes me sad.


What makes Masonry special are is what it is and those members who dedicate so much to it and its propagation.  While I too love our uniform, I believe a less costly uniform is needed, and needed now for the salvation of the Order. In my page here on uniforms I talk about the matter


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## Companion Joe (Jan 9, 2015)

I don't think the chapeaus and current uniforms as we know them are going away anytime soon, not in my lifetime.
When I started this thread, I was in the market for a good chapeau. I went ahead and sucked it up and bought a really nice one from New London Regalia. They were a tad more expensive, but worth it.
As I've said before, I'm not a great fan of the uniforms, but they are what they are. I'd like to see us go back to the frock coat.


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## JFS61 (Jan 10, 2015)

Shame that this thread got derailed, as I too would have liked to have learned of the various merits of the different chapeaus available. From what I've seen, the ones from New London do look quite nice.


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## Companion Joe (Jan 10, 2015)

Every thread about the Commandery gets jacked by people who don't like the uniforms.

As for New London, I think, from my recent research, they have the nicest chapeaus. They will run you about $100 more than the cheaper ones out there, but as I believe I have said earlier, if you are making a lifetime investment, the $100 is negligible. Go ahead and pay it up front for something you will be happy owning. Although I won't be commander until next year, I went ahead and bought my chapeau with gold trim and a past commander's rosette. I  wasn't going to get silver then have to have it torn apart and upgraded or buy another one. If someone belongs to a Commandery where anyone would have a problem with that, I'd suggest finding a new Commandery. We do have one guy that bought a lower end ($300) silver-trimmed chapeau when he first joined and said he'd just buy a New London when he was commander. I told him he has more money than sense.

Some of those $300 models (I won't mention where they come from, but you can get them at a few different places on the web) look, to me, like someone simply took a black cowboy hat, bent up the sides, and slapped a feather on top. They aren't formed the way a chapeau should look. I also looked at one of the vendors previously mentioned in this thread (again, I won't call them by name), and while considerably cheaper, they look to me to be that way for a reason.

If you put a New London chapeau next to all the others, you can spot the difference in the quality of appearance a mile away. They are worth the extra you pay up front. 

The only chapeaus that rival New London, in my opinion, are Kalamazoo Regalia (formerly Ihling Brothers or Ihling Everard if you come across an older one). They are a little more expensive than New London. The biggest problem I had when researching what to buy is Kalamazoo's web site only has black and white drawings of what their chapeaus look like. I'm not going to pay that kind of money for a pig in a poke. 

I was nervous buying from New London for kind of the same reason because of the fit. Sure enough, although I measured my head exactly, when it arrived, it didn't fit. It swallowed my head. I phoned New London, and they just had me send it back for a smaller size, no questions asked. Instead of measuring, I should have trusted my gut instinct of ordering the size I wear in other hats and what I discovered from trying on other people's chapeaus.


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## Willaim Perkins (Jan 10, 2015)

Companion Joe said:


> I don't think the chapeaus and current uniforms as we know them are going away anytime soon, not in my lifetime.
> When I started this thread, I was in the market for a good chapeau. I went ahead and sucked it up and bought a really nice one from New London Regalia. They were a tad more expensive, but worth it.
> As I've said before, I'm not a great fan of the uniforms, but they are what they are. I'd like to see us go back to the frock coat.


I joined in 1980 and coat was going thru a change then.  I want to change to a very inexpensive uniform instep with our ancient knights.


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## Companion Joe (Jan 10, 2015)

The uniform isn't the expensive part. The expensive parts are the chapeau and sword belts. The uniform can be purchased fairly inexpensively. 

As I have always said, you'll never get those with a complete setup and those without to agree. Now that I have purchased a really nice chapeau, no way under the sun do I ever vote in favor of adopting something different to make what I have obsolete. It's not like I'm going to wear it fishing.


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## Willaim Perkins (Jan 11, 2015)

Companion Joe said:


> The uniform isn't the expensive part. The expensive parts are the chapeau and sword belts. The uniform can be purchased fairly inexpensively.
> 
> As I have always said, you'll never get those with a complete setup and those without to agree. Now that I have purchased a really nice chapeau, no way under the sun do I ever vote in favor of adopting something different to make what I have obsolete. It's not like I'm going to wear it fishing.


I agree with your sentiment which why my proposal would not have a mandatory wear date. While it would affect the cap & mantle, the traditional uniform would go as the Knight is called to Final Assembly.


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## Warrior1256 (Jul 8, 2016)

Rifleman1776 said:


> efore I demited out of York Rite I was once told not to come to a Commandery meeting because I did not have a uniform.


I'm very sorry to hear this.


Companion Joe said:


> Just yesterday, we conferred the Order of the Temple on four new Sir Knights. I told them explicitly that they do not have to have uniforms to attend meetings,


This is the way it is in my Commandery. You only have to have the uniform if you want to be an officer.


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