# Cypher books or mouth to ear?



## rebis (Oct 11, 2013)

As most of you know, out here on the left coast, more specifically CA, for each of the three degrees, the candidate is given a very thin cypher book containing the proficiency work pertaining to the particular degree.

For example the EA booklet contains only the cypher for that degree...etc.

What are your opinions brothers on the pros and cons of such an approach when compared to the more traditional mouth to ear method?

S/F


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## Blake Bowden (Oct 11, 2013)

Damned if you do, damned if you don't has been my experience. I don't like them, but I couldn't of finished my work without one. Now before my Texas Brethren remind me that using one to learn the work is a no no, let me explain. Our Lodge had two Instructors, the Brother who helped me through the EA and half of the FC succomed to Cancer and passed. The second Instructor got me half way through the Master Mason work and he too became ill. The Brethren who DID know the work and could teach, didn't attend Lodge, much less care about teaching me or any other candidate.

In Texas (under the GLoTX) a MM can have a code book, but it is not to be used on Lodge Property. Unfortunately, it's starting to happen to the point where the Masonic Lodge is looking like the Elks Lodge. 

Ear to ear is the way it should be, but unless there is a Brother who is willing to step up and teach, you shouldn't feel guilty using one. Lodges LOVE to initiate new candidates, but shame on them if they don't provide an Instructor.


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## WilliamBixlerOK (Oct 11, 2013)

Word of mouth I think is great. Next month at grand lodge they will vote to see if cyphers can be used by less than MM. I think they are great for my mentor to be sure he is teaching me right but not for me to learn from. My son who is my teacher is a hard a## for the exact wording and I am glad for it because when I was teaching him things in Scouting I made sure it was correct. One opertive mason taught his study by word and deed, not by a book. Just starting but far from done with my journey, not stopping till 32nd and KT.


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## JJones (Oct 11, 2013)

Mouth to ear, I'm traditional like that.  There are circumstances where I can see the need to exceptions to this but I'd hate to see people become over-reliant on them for their memory work. 
This applies to learning the ritual as well.  Chapter and Council has suffered terribly from this concept and I've only seen one lodge fully open a Yorkrite body without using a ritual book...I can see this becoming the same problem in blue lodges if the wrong decisions are made.


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## Brother JC (Oct 11, 2013)

Just because you are given a cipher doesn't mean you don't learn mouth-to-ear. When my mentor and I were together we went one sentence at a time, adding the next one as I got them. I tried to only use the cipher when I was alone and got truly stuck.
Besides, if you don't already know what those letters mean, looking at them isn't going to help!


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## Paul E. Wunsche (Oct 11, 2013)

I agree with Brother Jones, cypher books have done far more harm in Chapter and Council than good. It took alot of the "Old" members (service, not age) raising a lot of salt before our Chapter and Council put them away.  I am proud to say that we do all of the work without a book, it may not be perfect but we have enough pride in ourselves and respect for the candidates not to use them. If they were used for the purpose for which the were created all would be good.  They are a great tool for those who wish to "Refresh" their memory prior to a degree or prior to renewing a certificate. What makes me laugh is the fact that they are illegal in Chapter/Council but are openly used by members.  They are legal in the Commandery as they are set by Grand Encampment but the are never opened during a meeting.  Must be a pride thing.  I,m not judging, I'm just saying......


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## crono782 (Oct 11, 2013)

I also echo the C&C woes. It's really sad to see some openings and closings and their reliance on the book. They are illegal in C&C?


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## JJones (Oct 11, 2013)

I always thought they were 'discouraged' but not illegal in C&C

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## Paul E. Wunsche (Oct 11, 2013)

I don't have my lawbook with me at work to give you the article number but they are illegal.  I say that, but the law allows one Companion and one Cmpanion only to have one open during a C/C meeting only to be used for prompting.


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## JohnnyFlotsam (Oct 11, 2013)

I think cypher books have there place, and that place is in the hands of the man learning this or that ritual. Being able to practice, review, and correct independently is a realistic expectation. That said, I also believe that there is no substitute for mouth-to-ear interaction either. In any case, they should never, ever be allowed in the Lodge room. Learn the ritual or get out of the chair.


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## rebis (Oct 11, 2013)

trysquare said:


> Just because you are given a cipher doesn't mean you don't learn mouth-to-ear. When my mentor and I were together we went one sentence at a time, adding the next one as I got them. I tried to only use the cipher when I was alone and got truly stuck.
> Besides, if you don't already know what those letters mean, looking at them isn't going to help!



Ditto


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## dfreybur (Oct 11, 2013)

trysquare said:


> Just because you are given a cipher doesn't mean you don't learn mouth-to-ear.



Actually, just because you were given a cipher is does mean your only choice is mouth to ear.  Each symbol might mean any of several words so you need to know what the words are to be able to read it.  Ciphers really are "a valuable aid to the memory" and not more than that.  The written out ritual books work differently.



> Besides, if you don't already know what those letters mean, looking at them isn't going to help!



Exactly.


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## bezobrazan (Oct 11, 2013)

I'm in CA and we use them. Every cipher book I worked through was with a coach. Eventually the book was completely put away and everything was done mouth to ear. 

We live in a time where it takes two incomes to survive, not to mention life is no longer simple for anyone. Coordinating a time with your coach has it's challenges. I am old school in some regards, I insisted on long form and do my proficiencies with meaning. Not rapid fire parroting that sounds like I'm at an auction. 


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## fbecke (Oct 12, 2013)

I have a cipher book. 


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## jeffself (Oct 14, 2013)

In Georgia it's mouth to ear


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## jvarnell (Oct 14, 2013)

I learn in all ways.  I don't pick any over another.  Not to hijack this thread but has anyone that has a cypher book ever looked at sir Isaac newton's alchemy cyphers?


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## SeattleMason0613 (Oct 16, 2013)

Here in Washington we use cyphers. However grand lodge gives us a huge binder with the work printed on regular size paper...but luckily I have a cypher because it's hard to carry the thing around and whip it out whenever and read 


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## NonNobis (Oct 17, 2013)

Mouth to ear in West Virginia. I personally like it better this way. I have acted in plays in college and memorized several poems by reading, but never have I taken part in a true oral tradition as I have here with my brethren. For some reason it feels more important this way. It is said that some of the greatest works of western literature, the Iliad and Odyssey, were passed through the centuries mouth to ear, bard to audience, master to pupil. I am proud and truly privileged to participate in the great and important work of our most excellent institution. 


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## Roy Vance (Oct 17, 2013)

trysquare said:


> Just because you are given a cipher doesn't mean you don't learn mouth-to-ear. When my mentor and I were together we went one sentence at a time, adding the next one as I got them. I tried to only use the cipher when I was alone and got truly stuck.
> Besides, if you don't already know what those letters mean, looking at them isn't going to help!



Before I petitioned, I was in my younger brother's pick-up and saw this little plain, blue book with nothing written on the cover. I picked it up and opened it and, lo and behold, I could not understand a thing that was written in the thing. I said to myself that it must have something to do with the "Shrine", as he is also a Shriner. Well, as it turns out, after being initiated, passed and raised, I was given one of these strange little plain, blue books by him and, lo and behold, when I opened it up, I could understand almost everything in the thing. The moral of this story: you still have to know your stuff to understand the cypher book, and should only use it in a dire case of a really bad "brain fart."

Edit: I only use mine just before a degree to make sure that my ritual is correct, then I leave it on the desk at home.


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## Rob427W (Oct 17, 2013)

Being a two day old Entered Apprentice, I just started regular study for proficiency last evening.

Maryland uses the cipher books, and I have to say that I'm quite glad for that.  However, by the time everything is done and over with, as far as the proficiencies go, I never want to see a cipher book again.  And I sure hope that my memory keeps all that tucked away in a safe place so I never forget it.

The instructors who will be teaching the current five man group use more mouth to ear than cipher book, but we are left to memorize from the book after we've left the instruction group for the evening.


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## Prince Saif Shallah (Oct 18, 2013)

Great memory is beSt. You want to carry the degrees with you at all times. 


Prince Saif Shallah


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## WilliamBixlerOK (Oct 22, 2013)

Been working with my son, I have only looked at his cypher to see how it is written.  Sun I was correcting him when he left out questions,  has been 100% mouth to ear and the hardest part has been my hearing him. I am nearly deaf and must concentrate hard to get it, but it is coming and I would not want to learn any other way. This has brought my son and I closer than we have been in years and we were already VERY close. I plan on getting my certificates so I can pass this on to more brothers. Leave the books out of it unless it is to refresh.

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## NativeSteel (Oct 22, 2013)

Mouth to ear at first, then cipher book for brush up after years have passed. Thats how i have seen it.

" SEMPER ANTICUS "


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## pythagoras3399 (Oct 23, 2013)

In Ohio, we are allowed to have the cypher book for the rituals. The lodge provides one for each chair, but you can purchase your own from the Grand Lodge if you want to pay $50. 

But, it still requires someone to teach you by mouth to ear to read it. Once you are taught to read it, the cypher is just to brush up. When in the lodge room it's all from memory. Open, close, degree work, everything from memory. 


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## marty15chris (Oct 23, 2013)

I just starting instructing and I'm doing it mouth to ear but with me using the cipher for reference. I don't let the " student" see it but just use it to check my work and his. Any thoughts from the brothers? 


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## dfreybur (Oct 24, 2013)

At the annual GL meeting this year California rejected having one brother with an open cipher book as a prompter at opened meetings.


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## Bro. Michael (Dec 10, 2013)

I prefer mouth to ear. It is how I learned, and, as Albert Einstein once said, "Why would I memorize something I can find in a book?" Inevitably knowledge is more secure and better retained when it must be memorized and cannot be made readily available via a book or other source.

Besides the practical purpose, I am a man of tradition, and I hold most practices which have stood the test of time to be superior to most of those that have not. Not all long-standing traditions are better, but in this instance, I feel the traditional method is superior.


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## Thulsa Doom (Dec 10, 2013)

Cypher book memorization still requires mouth to ear instruction. The advantage it offers is that the candidate can study quietly alone several times per day as necessary and check/confirm his word choice against the book. IMO the book is worthless without instruction.


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