# PHA Tattoos??



## Jamarr/G\

Greetings squares! A close brother and I had an great conversation about brothers getting their li/G\ht tattooed on their bodies. Yes we are both M.M . But how do you all feel about brothers getting masonic tattoos?? 

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## bupton52

Jamarr/G\ said:


> Greetings squares! A close brother and I had an great conversation about brothers getting their li/G\ht tattooed on their bodies. Yes we are both M.M . But how do you all feel about brothers getting masonic tattoos??
> 
> Freemason Connect Mobile


Their body, their money. No problems at all. I have one as well.


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## bro jimmie

*Go for it*

if you feel ok with it.


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## Jamarr/G\

Yeah I was just looking for opinions . I know some brothers see masonic tattoos in an offensive way. 

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## BrotherChar

If they see such things in a offensive way they must be mindful of their brothers place in a noble institution and realize that all of our individual temples each have their own hallmarks and delights, and since it does no harm to the order, let them allow their brothers the cornerstones and columns of their own creation as long as it harms none and bears fruit for the Great Work


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## Jamarr/G\

Well said brother .. SMIB! 

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## draekell

I have a question how do u brothers feel bout removing piercings & gages on initiates going through degree work

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## bupton52

They get removed.


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## dfreybur

Jamarr/G\ said:


> Yeah I was just looking for opinions . I know some brothers see masonic tattoos in an offensive way.



I think it's a generational thing.  My Dad thinks tattoos are for criminals.  I'm of a generation that doesn't disapprove of tattoos and have mostly gotten used to them but I don't have any myself.  My grown kids have tattoos.

As to metal in piercings, I was pretty relieved to learn that Navy boot camp lasts just long enough for a hole in the tongue to heal over.  And that boot camp tends to leave a person busy enough they can forget to get another one.  So no tongue piercings in my grown kids, whew.


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## jaermani

I have tattoos


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## Scorpionlawz

Minerals and metals.  Nothing off...nor def...& building of KS temple, no sound of axe....

That's why you remove jewelry. 


Bro. Junior A. Knight 
Chicopee Lodge
GL Massachusetts AF&AM


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## jaermani

Oh okay thank you


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## tldubb

Nothing metallic, I have also been under the belief that any type of masonic tattoo on the body is taboo. Take a look at the Charge for E.A. as far as tattoo's go.


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## DJGurkins

I believe if you are referring to EA then it is not allowed but as far as a MM I have yet to see any secrets as a tattoo. That being said I have tattoos but no masonic YET. I probably will get one after I am raised at some point. I have seen this discussion on here before and I believe most of the Brothers feel ok by them.


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## Jamarr/G\

Interesting points guys!  Keep 'em coming.  And yes I am a MM and I do plan on getting a Masonic tattoo soon. I'm just wondering how other brothers view them. 

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## bruce harris

About tats if If you decide to be man of of your word we all lie


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## Cookboy4200

I have Psalms 133 tatted on my rib cage


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## mjhv1990

I want to join the freemazons but i have a tatoo on my chest that is an upside down triangle with a closed eye inside and the text above it reads. "With your eyes closed, close your eyes" would that be mason offensive? Or would that be ok?

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## crono782

I doubt it would be taken offensively


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## Jamarr/G\

Same here man I think you'll be fine.

 .. I have two arm sleeves and a chest tat and I was still able to be entered passed and raised. 

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## Sir-Knight Vineyard

Great Points brothers!!! It's no secret Iam a Mason!!! Tshirts, Emblems, tattoos, are all fine just Sq... Your actions in your ...., well you all know the rest SMIB


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## Brother JC

The EA Obligation refers to the written word, not images. If images were a violation, half our wardrobe, all of our paintings and pictures, our rings, etc, would all be considered a violation. As long as you don't tattoo the pass-words or other spoken secrets, there's nothing wrong with a tattoo.

As to piercings, my gauges are glass, so I got to leave them in, though the Stewards did check them to make sure the weren't metal. As was said before, no metal in the Temple.


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## knight_templar

It mainly refers to not having images where the secrets may be obtained. I have the square and compass tattooed on me now if a non mason sees that he doesn't know tge meaning behind those tools so the emblem could not possibly reveal our secrets directly.  But you are right as long as you do not have the passwords on your body then it should not be a violation. 

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## Cutt_DeVille

I'm not a freemason but I am talking with my local lodge about joining. I have always had great fascination with freemasonry and my family members are freemason. I was curious if freemasons would be offended by me having the compass already tattooed on my hand but not being a brother yet. 



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## knight_templar

Um why do you have that if your not a mason?

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## Cutt_DeVille

Because I express myself and the things that are a love or influence in my life with my tattoos. 


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## knight_templar

Well you neex to ask tgem to covee up your tat if you get accepted and go through the degrees that's a major no no so be up front with them before joining and tell them that you were unaware about you having the tattoo before your a master mason

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## MarkR

Cutt_DeVille said:


> I'm not a freemason but I am talking with my local lodge about joining. I have always had great fascination with freemasonry and my family members are freemason. *I was curious if freemasons would be offended by me having the compass already tattooed on my hand but not being a brother yet.*
> 
> 
> Freemason Connect HD


Speaking only for myself, yes.


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## crono782

I'm not sure if I'd be "offended" per say, but it is a bit presumptuous an off-putting perhaps. Would a marine be mad if you had a USMC tat before ever joining? Maybe, maybe not. 


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## Cutt_DeVille

I'm mean I'm not going around saying I am a freemason. I just tattoo things I'm into and support. Also a family thing.


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## Travelin357

Wow Really?!

Travelin357


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## Blake Bowden

Cutt_DeVille said:


> I was curious if freemasons would be offended by me having the compass already tattooed on my hand but not being a brother yet. View attachment 3454
> 
> 
> Freemason Connect HD



In your case, absolutely!! You don't have the right to display the S&C nor do you understand the symbology behind them. Most Brethren spend weeks, months, even years to reach the level of Master Mason to earn the right to wear the S&C. The difference between the aforementioned Brethren and you is they'd be able to defend the light--to explain the symbology behind everything. You would be labeled a cowan and if you petitioned my Lodge, I'd be hard pressed to vote favorably for you. During my work, 2 out of 3 of my mentors passed away. What they instilled in me weren't just the questions and answers, but the meaning behind them. What do the degrees mean? What lessons are taught during certain areas? Freemasonry isn't some bullcrap you can look online. I don't care how many articles you read or videos you watch, a Brother will call you out. Sorry, but I have zero tolerance for wanna be Masons. If you didn't earn it, you shouldn't wear it.


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## Gomabxi

I belong to other organizations and if I saw any resemblance of any of the organizations I would approach the person and ask questions to be satisfied that I'm speaking to a legit Brother. If my determination is that the person is a fraud, I would not be to happy. I take my organization brands very serious. Speaking for myself I am not happy about it. I'm what you might call old school and we definitely would have issues. 


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## txtraveller

Your respect and admiration for Freemasonry aren't in question but I definitely agree with the opinion that the display of any mark of accomplishment should only be worn or displayed by those who have gone the mile to accomplish something as honorable as the Degrees of Masonry. But the fact remains that you have already put the ink in your skin and out if respect for the Lodge that you approach I would recommend being completely forthcoming with it. I'm sorry if this hurts your sensitivities but I feel it was quite immature and thoughtless to display something on your body that you did not earn. And I'm also quite sure you will be met with distrust. 


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## dfreybur

Putting the square and compasses on your skin is declaring to the world that you have earned the status of Master Mason.  The word for people who pretend to be Master Masons is "cowan".  It is not a good status.  It is the same as claiming veteran status without having served in the military.  it is the same as wearing a wedding ring when have never been married.

I figure your best next step is to have the names of Masons in your family tattooed around it.  Something like "In memory of" on one side, "Dad and Uncle Joe" on the other.


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## crod

I agree with the comment above.




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## Bang

I wholeheartedly agree....if you didn't earn it, don't wear it!!!!


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## Bill Lins

crono782 said:


> Would a Marine be mad if you had a USMC tat before ever joining? Maybe, maybe not.


You'd better believe he would be!


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## MarkR

Bill_Lins77488 said:


> You'd better believe he would be!


I knew some Marines who would have cut it off you with a Ka-Bar knife.


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## recondo

I have tattoos and love the art of tattoos... And i am a soldier in the us army , But there are do and don't of tattoos....case in point I work with rangers it's doesn't give me the right to tattoo a ranger tab on my arm if I never went to ranger school....I believe if you earn it wear it. 


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## samelevel

Absolutely ..., don't pretend to be what you are not!


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## BigDre357

Cutt_DeVille said:


> I'm not a freemason but I am talking with my local lodge about joining. I have always had great fascination with freemasonry and my family members are freemason. I was curious if freemasons would be offended by me having the compass already tattooed on my hand but not being a brother yet. View attachment 3454
> 
> 
> Freemason Connect HD



Why would you do that....the chances of you becoming a Brother is probably slim to none at this point

SMIB /G\


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## cbastian

You should be real carefull of things you do.ask before trying.pease


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## larrytrip357

Wow....


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## Tattooist

larrytrip357 said:


> Wow....
> 
> 
> My Freemasonry HD



You should of waited till you become a brother it seems very disrespectfull in the presence of a real free mason , I know how I feel when I see someone with it who is not a true and lawfull brother ! Just my two cents nice tattoo tho


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## pecolaman

Crono. you ask if a Marine would  be mad if some one had a tat of the EGA and they were not a real Marine.  Speaking on behalf of all real Devil Dog He@#&#&#*l f\#&#&#*#king yes and would tear it from his body limb intact.  Wait wait I am older now so I would ask do he know what it takes to be a Marine and if he is willing to take orders from someone and not question as long as it is not murder rape or to massacre. I would ask if he is willing to lay down his life for another Marine or man is he willing to run into the gun fire and not away. Now if he will do that and more then go put your name on the dotted line and stand on those little yellow foot prints that many goodmen have stood on before him and don't dishonor them as those men did it  and so much much more.  

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## LBCutta

Wow!!!


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## hweaveriii

I am certain a profane with such a tattoo would never make it beyond the investigation 


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## bushwickrich

You really should of waited before getting a tattoo like that. There is a lot of meaning behind it 


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## safehouse

I think a man has the right to try and correct his wrongs. 

If I were him I would be open about his attraction to masonry. 

Apply for membership, become a master mason and wear it with pride. 

The man is in darkness and in need the light. We should take him under our Wing and teach him. 

Everyman has a right to correct his wrongs. Tatoo or no tatoo when he comes, he will come for his moral worth as a man, and will be measured and weighed according to his good repute among friends and neighbours, his tattoo will then make more sense to him. 


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## safehouse

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## DaRabboni

Jamarr/G\ said:


> Greetings squares! A close brother and I had an great conversation about brothers getting their li/G\ht tattooed on their bodies. Yes we are both M.M . But how do you all feel about brothers getting masonic tattoos??
> 
> I wouldn't get a M.M tat until you get your Mark Master if you know like I know but as a master mason if you can protect it then do it


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## Warden

Wow, Wow, and Wow!!!!!!!!!  Very disrespectful!!!!! I would luv for u to petition! Can't wait to meet u!! Hw ur family members reacted??


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## bupton52

Warden said:


> Wow, Wow, and Wow!!!!!!!!!  Very disrespectful!!!!! I would luv for u to petition! Can't wait to meet u!! Hw ur family members reacted??
> 
> 
> My Freemasonry HD



What is disrespectful about a masonic tattoo?


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## crono782

bupton52 said:


> What is disrespectful about a masonic tattoo?



I think he is saying WE are being disrespectful for our comments suggesting he should not have gotten the tattoo unless he was a MM?

Brethren, think of it this way. WE as Masons, know that you ought to not wear the symbol if you haven't earned it and know the meanings behind it. I believe our judgment of someone in such a situation is colored by our knowledge of this fact. I can see how someone might respect Freemasons enough to get the S&C tattooed without being a mason (and I realize that the distinction between admiration vs getting it to be "cool" is an important one). Were the case to be just a misjudgment, all can be forgiven if thoroughly explained (and attempts to keep it hidden until such time as it is earned) and all. It seems to me a simple mistake rather than a slap in the face as some (myself included) have previously felt. Just a thought...


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## Brother JC

I thought he was referring to the non-Mason with the S&C on his hand. I can see his point there.


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## masonicdove

As a recently passed FC I found this thread interesting. Getting a tattoo is probably one of the last things on my mind as I along with my ct study for our proficiency exam. As I read through the various responses and even his own initial posting one question comes to mind. "What did the freemasons in his family have to say about getting the tattoo?" It appears they are fine with it or either they just did not say anything to his face. Personally, I could not get anything tattooed on me which I didn't fully know the meaning of it or were a part of what it meant. In my opinion, I think, if he approaches a lodge, he will have a "whole lot" of explaining to do. It is ultimately on that lodge to decide to accept or reject his petition. In my mind I get it, "you are trying to show love and respect to your family". Nevertheless, he is not even an EA. As my Senior Warden said to me the other night, "it's more then getting to wear a ring or have an emblem on your car." It's deeper and that is what this guy has failed to understand. In essence getting the C&S tattooed on your hand and being a non-mason makes as much sense of me getting a Kappa Diamond branded on my arm just because my grandfather was a member Kappa Alpha Psi.


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## DaRabboni

What I was saying that as a M.M you can get the S&C as the emblem of your profession...

For the sake of semantics.. UGLE Proclamation 1813...to call yourself a M.M you must truly be exalted...so to get the S&C on your body meant that you W-I-P-P-S-S-H-C-C-M or E on your body which is moveable...therby why where someone might get something unlawfully because they could see it....

So for the sake of asking...If I walked up to a M.M and asked him to give me the "real word of a Master Mason" (3rd Degree) You couldnt...only a sub...you was made a M.M at the grave...gotta come back inside the temple...

Im just saying for the sake of semantics...I said I would not do it...I wouldnt do it...

and I am a M.M
Pride of Beaumont #291 MWPHATXGL (Currently Daniel Chappie James#72 MWPHAWAGL)
William L. Gardner #82 HRAM


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## MarkR

DaRabboni said:


> UGLE Proclamation 1813


Very few of us are under the jurisdiction of the United Grand Lodge of England.


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## DaRabboni

MarkR said:


> Very few of us are under the jurisdiction of the United Grand Lodge of England.



Just simply stating for the sake of semantics...even on the 3rd degree as a MM...if you can protect it...wear it...but a MM is not a complete..because think about it...you still outside the temple at the burial site

at the end of the day

Your body...Your Money...Your Tattoo...


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## crono782

Also as said before, you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who agreed that the *image* of the S&C is a closely guarded secret that should be removed from all masonic buildings, fliers, etc. 


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## Brother JC

Brother, that refers to the written word, not the symbols. By your definition, every sign on every lodge, every ring, every painting ever made violates our Obligation.


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## DaRabboni

crono782 said:


> Also as said before, you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who agreed that the *image* of the S&C is a closely guarded secret that should be removed from all masonic buildings, fliers, etc.
> 
> 
> My Freemasonry HD



Now that isn't entirely true. As a M.M a true M.M not a suped-up-FC...you can put your your mark on your work for the benefit of instruction or to show your work is your work...but as a fellow-craft you cant...you still out in the quarry wroughting with stones with your S-L-& P looking to see if its good work...true work...square work to be brought to the temple...you only can give instruction to other FC and EA's so if you found something that was irregular...that had HTWSSKS...you wouldnt know what to do with it...

Its a matter of interpretation...dont get anything you cannot protect


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## MarkR

In America, a Master Mason is quite complete. I'm a Scottish Rite Mason, and I'm of the understanding that the word we get in the 13Â° (Royal Arch of Solomon) is a little different than what the York Rite gives in the Holy Royal Arch. So who's right? And what difference does it make, since it's all allegory anyway, intended to convey lessons of morality?

This whole "being able to protect it" thing seems to be a Prince Hall thing anyway.

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## DaRabboni

"Protect" to me is a loose turn for respect...if you incured a person with a masonic emblem...and you did something of that sign and the person couldn't or didnt know how to react to the sign or whatever it might be...the conversation or masonic conversation would end right there as a matter of protection for me anyways


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## Brother JC

DaRabboni said:


> Now that isn't entirely true. As a M.M a true M.M not a suped-up-FC...you can put your your mark on your work for the benefit of instruction or to show your work is your work...


So, anyone who hasn't gone through Royal Arch is a "suped-up-FC?" That's a little harsh.


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## DaRabboni

trysquare said:


> So, anyone who hasn't gone through Royal Arch is a "suped-up-FC?" That's a little harsh.



Little harsh but true...you was in the inner room...and left outside to be made a M.M outside the building site...never came back in...so how you meet in the Unfinished S-S...you think KS let those 12 who conspired to murder him...you think he let them back inside the temple? it was only them 12 that was made M.M at the grave site...it was 80k FC at back in the quarry...

thats just my opinion in PHA Tatoos... I dont see anything wrong with it...just know what your getting before you get it


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## MarkR

DaRabboni said:


> "Protect" to me is a loose turn for respect...if you incured a person with a masonic emblem...and you did something of that sign and the person couldn't or didnt know how to react to the sign or whatever it might be...the conversation or masonic conversation would end right there as a matter of protection for me anyways


Okay, but if you tried me with York Rite Royal Arch stuff, you'd find me lacking, because I'm not York Rite. So even though I'm a 32Â° Knight Commander of the Court of Honor in the Scottish Rite, you consider me a "souped-up Fellowcraft?"


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## DaRabboni

MarkR said:


> Okay, but if you tried me with York Rite Royal Arch stuff, you'd find me lacking, because I'm not York Rite. So even though I'm a 32Â° Knight Commander of the Court of Honor in the Scottish Rite, you consider me a "souped-up Fellowcraft?"



No if I asked if you were a Mark Master Mason..your reply would be no...thats ends the conversation on that...if you tried me on Select Master...I couldn't go there because I have not done the Consistory Scottish Rite...Things that are veiled in allegory can be debated upon, but a person who has only completed one side of the Compass is often referred to as a 33 fellow craft...

So going back to the M.M...I would ask you...Are you a M.M...what induced you to become a Master Mason...then I would ask you to give me the Master's Word if you are a Master Mason...

Is the Temple complete on the Scottish Rite side...I dont know...if it is...I'll have to see when I get there


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## perryel

DaRabboni said:


> No if I asked if you were a Mark Master Mason..your reply would be no...thats ends the conversation on that...if you tried me on Select Master...I couldn't go there because I have not done the Consistory Scottish Rite...Things that are veiled in allegory can be debated upon, but a person who has only completed one side of the Compass is often referred to as a 33 fellow craft...
> 
> So going back to the M.M...I would ask you...Are you a M.M...what induced you to become a Master Mason...then I would ask you to give me the Master's Word if you are a Master Mason...
> 
> Is the Temple complete on the Scottish Rite side...I dont know...if it is...I'll have to see when I get there



Select Master is YR; major inconsistency with your reply.  Confirmed my suspicions...hope no one else engages you in this discussion.  It's been unnecessarily disrespectful to every worthy Master Mason.  Now we all can see why.  As so many good men have stated, reading a monitor doesn't make you a Freemason.


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## DaRabboni

perryel said:


> Select Master is YR; major inconsistency with your reply.  Confirmed my suspicions...hope no one else engages you in this discussion.  It's been unnecessarily disrespectful to every worthy Master Mason.  Now we all can see why.  As so many good men have stated, reading a monitor doesn't make you a Freemason.



I was mistaken on the YR SR side...

Check my credentials 

MWPHAGL of TX Pride of Beaumont Lodge 291 
MWPHAGl of WA Daniel Chappie James #72
William L Gardner #82 Grand Chapter HRAM (WA JD)

Im not saying that you are not a Master Mason...but in a matter speculation and masonic allegory...if you are in the blue lodge only...you dont have the Master's word...

need a picture of my dues card too?


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## crono782

It is important to remember there existed a time before the Hiramic Legend was laid down. I wonder if, back then, they thought of themselves as incomplete before a MM degree ever was. Because somebody in antiquity decided to extend Masonry with the opportunity of attaining light beyond what already was, does that necessarily nullify/cheapen/lessen the degrees that came before? We read from Masonic scholars such as Pike, Gould, and others that the chiefest and most profound of Masonic truths are to be found in Blue Masonry, being that of the first three degrees. Something to ponder.


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## DaRabboni

crono782 said:


> It is important to remember there existed a time before the Hiramic Legend was laid down. I wonder if, back then, they thought of themselves as incomplete before a MM degree ever was. Because somebody in antiquity decided to extend Masonry with the opportunity of attaining light beyond what already was, does that necessarily nullify/cheapen/lessen the degrees that came before? We read from Masonic scholars such as Pike, Gould, and others that the chiefest and most profound of Masonic truths are to be found in Blue Masonry, being that of the first three degrees. Something to ponder.



But remember before then...the MM had the Master's word...it wasn't until the FC degree was split in to two degrees...and the Master's word was forgot to be put back in to it

But Crono you are right


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## MarkR

DaRabboni said:


> But remember before then...the MM had the Master's word...it wasn't until the FC degree was split in to two degrees...and the Master's word was forgot to be put back in to it
> 
> But Crono you are right


The "Mason Word" of 17th century Scottish Masonry is far closer to our current "substitute word" than anything that is given as "the lost word" in high-degree Masonry today.


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## ikeman

Question what degree has the last words over my body I believe  it the sublime it's  of a MM 


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## Spawny

The masters word is veiled in the 3 degrees. Most important lodge reflects the sea. Guy with hand tat couldn't come to DC. 


On my way to the East.


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## tldubb

perryel said:


> Select Master is YR; major inconsistency with your reply.  Confirmed my suspicions...hope no one else engages you in this discussion.  It's been unnecessarily disrespectful to every worthy Master Mason.  Now we all can see why.  As so many good men have stated, reading a monitor doesn't make you a Freemason.



Ditto!

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