My Freemasonry | Freemason Information and Discussion Forum

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Prince Hall Chartered Freemasony in South Africa

Justin Buirski

Registered User
Brethren.

I was recently asked a question about race segregation in South African lodges during the Apartheid regime.
I undertook to locate an article written by two brethren of my lodge some years ago.

In searching my digital archives all I could locate was a link to an upload to Petrie Stones where the article has been superbly stored, hopefully for prosperity.

Here is the link: http://www.freemasons-freemasonry.com/freemasons_apartheid.html

To the MyFreemasonry staff - if posting a link to a competitive host breached the rules please feel free to moderate/delete.

Fraternally

Justin Buirki
 

BroBook

Premium Member
Question, so does that they do not recognize Prince Hall as a body of legal masons?


Bro Book
M.W.U.G.L. Of Fl: P.H.A.
Excelsior # 43
At pensacola
 

Justin Buirski

Registered User
To the best of my knowledge there remain no PHA Chartered lodges in South Africa.
Our PHA Lodges surrendered their charters and switched allegiance to the Grand Lodge of South Africa in 1977.

Frats

Justin


Sent From My Freemasonry Pro App
 

BroBook

Premium Member
Excuse me brothers, what I am asking is if a Prince Hall Mason was in South Africa would he be allowed to visit?


Bro Book
M.W.U.G.L. Of Fl: P.H.A.
Excelsior # 43
At pensacola
 

Justin Buirski

Registered User
Excuse me brothers, what I am asking is if a Prince Hall Mason was in South Africa would he be allowed to visit?


Bro Book
M.W.U.G.L. Of Fl: P.H.A.
Excelsior # 43
At pensacola
I hear you but cannot quite give you a definitive definite answer.
Visiting the GLSA craft lodges would require the foreign jurisdiction to be in amity.
To my current knowledge, perhaps significantly outdated, we have current amity with Prince Hall Connecticut as well as Prince Hall Massachusetts.
The 1977 Prince Hall Pennsylvania Chartered brethren that switched and affiliated had visitation rights, as mentioned, across all four local jurisdictions, but by virtue of their new GLSA memberships.

There is a further, new, angle known as 'the brother of my brother' concept. To me it seems that if a Prince Hall mason from an unrecognised PH jurisdiction were to visit in the company of a brother from another jurisdiction with which we are in amity, then, provided the visiting brethren are in amity with each other, I would be obliged to admit him.

I cannot officially confirm that all GLSA lodges would have the same approach.
Even more complicated would be a visit to our local 'sister' constitutions over which we have no sovereign control whatsoever.

Clear as mud!

Fraternally

Justin Buirski
 
Last edited:

dfreybur

Premium Member
Excuse me brothers, what I am asking is if a Prince Hall Mason was in South Africa would he be allowed to visit?

Since recognition needs to go both ways you'd need to know the answer for both jurisdictions. It's up to you to look up your own jurisdiction's recognition list. It's up to the visited jurisdiction to look up if they recognize yours.

Here's a first step that will easily get you to a "probably" or "definitely not". It's by looking up jurisdictions in the UGLE list. A high percentage of jurisdictions have recognition lists that closely match the UGLE. If one of the two jurisdiction involved is not listed the answer is no and you're done. If both are listed the answer is probably. You can look up your own end and then contact them letting them look up on their own end.

http://www.ugle.org.uk/about

Look up in the Provinces tab for inside the UK, in the Districts & Groups tab, in the Foreign Grand Lodges tab.

There are UGLE Districts working in South Africa. If you want to visit one of their lodges you know if they recognize by finding your own jurisdiction in the list.

In your case you are a member of the MWPHA Union GLofFL. It's not in the North America tab of the Foreign Grand Lodges page. Until there's recognition in Florida theh answer for you is no.

The second step is the regular PHA list. All jurisdictions in the list recognize each other -

http://www.conferenceofgrandmasterspha.org/gjlinks.asp
 

tldubb

Premium Member
Wow very interesting I knew that my GL chartered numerous lodges in the western hemisphere but as far as South Africa. MWPHGL Jurisdiction of Pennsylvania, Absalom Jones, received1 the charter from Prince Hall himself and we were styled African Lodge 459b. Absalom Jones, was a very important piece of Freemasonry unmong African Americans.

Bro.dfreybur, we are having a raising June 14th at 4301 N. Broad Street, Philadelphia at the temple. I would like to invite you.

Bro. Todd L. Wilson, Junior Deacon
Clarence C. Kittrell Lodge, #149 ( PHA )
MWPHGL Jurisdiction of Pennsylvania
4301 N. Broad Street Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
www.princehall-pa.org

Sent From My Freemasonry Pro App
 

Justin Buirski

Registered User
Nice to have heard from you Bro. Wilson.
It would be interesting to know what record/comment your Grand Lodge holds regarding the switch of allegiance, in 1977, of Lodge Southern Cross 75 and Lodge St Patrick 76. Any comment you may find regarding the DGM Phirose Gorvalla would also be appreciated.
As a conferred Past Grand Senior Warden in the GLSA Phirose went on to become a respected Right Worshipful Brother in this jurisdiction.
Fraternal regards
Justin Buirski
 

tldubb

Premium Member
Greetings, I'm going to contact our Grand Historian with the above information and looking forward to what is discovered.

Fraternally
Bro. Todd L. Wilson

Sent From My Freemasonry Pro App
 

tldubb

Premium Member
Bro. Justin,

If your ever in Philadelphia we the brethren of Clarence C. Kittrell, #149 ( PHA ) would love to show true brotherly from the city of brotherly love.

Sent From My Freemasonry Pro App
 

Attachments

  • 1400953845999.jpg
    1400953845999.jpg
    83.9 KB · Views: 780
  • 1400953957638.jpg
    1400953957638.jpg
    80.6 KB · Views: 680
  • 1400953982033.jpg
    1400953982033.jpg
    67.3 KB · Views: 3,087

dfreybur

Premium Member
Bro.dfreybur, we are having a raising June 14th at 4301 N. Broad Street, Philadelphia at the temple. I would like to invite you.

Kind of far from San Antonio so I thank you for the invitation and need to decline this time. I did check to make sure my gloves are easily available though. Broad Street? I will enjoy a cheese steak vicariously. We had home made ones a couple days ago.
 

Majoos

Registered User
Being a South African who grew up and lived under the brutal apartheid regime I can tell you this. The whites in South Africa was never aware that black masons namely prince hall even existed. They only discovered it its existence in the 1970s. Had they known about it earlier they would have suppressed it. Founded in 1905 by a AME missionary from America. The PH Masons was mainly in the Cape and consisted mainly of Colord teachers, clergy and traders. All upstanding men in their communities. Because of apartheid and the call by liberation movements to sanction and disinvest in Sout Africa, the PH masons became even more isolated from the grand lodge in Philidelphia. There was hardly any communication. So when they got discovered they were completely vulnerable to any possible action from the regime. White masons negotiated and onvinced apartheid government to allow PH masons to be coopted into so called mainstream masonry. My take on it ss a veteran anti apartheid activist informs me that political reasons was behind it. I know this is not a forum for political discussion and pardon my use of racial terms. That's the only way to explain apartheid. White supremacy and Apartheid was not just forced segregation of race. It was a brutal evil demon infested system. That's why it was impossible for PH masons to operate openly.
 

Majoos

Registered User
Excuse me brothers, what I am asking is if a Prince Hall Mason was in South Africa would he be allowed to visit?


Bro Book
M.W.U.G.L. Of Fl: P.H.A.
Excelsior # 43
At pensacola
Because PH masons are now fully recognized by the UGLE I would think it's possible to visit a lodge in SA. Remember PH is still in possession of its original charter. Full prove that we were legal masons for over 200 years. It's just a pity that race politics kept us apart for so long. Thank God that's over now.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
Because PH masons are now fully recognized by the UGLE I would think it's possible to visit a lodge in SA. Remember PH is still in possession of its original charter. Full prove that we were legal masons for over 200 years. It's just a pity that race politics kept us apart for so long. Thank God that's over now.
The individual PHA GLs are not all in amity with UGLE and certainly not all with the GL of SA. The PHA GSec can check. If he doesn’t know, my office can send an email.
 

Nhlanhla Khumalo

Registered User
Being a South African who grew up and lived under the brutal apartheid regime I can tell you this. The whites in South Africa was never aware that black masons namely prince hall even existed. They only discovered it its existence in the 1970s. Had they known about it earlier they would have suppressed it. Founded in 1905 by a AME missionary from America. The PH Masons was mainly in the Cape and consisted mainly of Colord teachers, clergy and traders. All upstanding men in their communities. Because of apartheid and the call by liberation movements to sanction and disinvest in Sout Africa, the PH masons became even more isolated from the grand lodge in Philidelphia. There was hardly any communication. So when they got discovered they were completely vulnerable to any possible action from the regime. White masons negotiated and onvinced apartheid government to allow PH masons to be coopted into so called mainstream masonry. My take on it ss a veteran anti apartheid activist informs me that political reasons was behind it. I know this is not a forum for political discussion and pardon my use of racial terms. That's the only way to explain apartheid. White supremacy and Apartheid was not just forced segregation of race. It was a brutal evil demon infested system. That's why it was impossible for PH masons to operate openly.
It is for this reason I feel that black people in South Africa are disadvantaged in becoming freemasons. We are very disappointed in our coloured brothers for surrendering the charter for whatever reasons. Some of us would like to join freemasonry under PH for the same reasons of shared history and condition.
 

Nhlanhla Khumalo

Registered User
Greetings once again. Pardon me for my lack of knowledge of the operations of the fraternity. I am a black south African and would like to join freemasonry so far I have knock on several doors of freemasons asking for assistance only to get silence respond. I find freemasonry to be structured as social club for few white elites who are not prepared to mix with lower middleclass specifically the black middle class. Missionaries were so desperate to get us into Christianity but to be a freemason. Someone told me I have to work up myself to a CEO of some institution to be a freemason. I thought freemasonry is an organisation of Enlighted beings who wanna share the light with the world.
 

bupton52

Moderator
Premium Member
It is for this reason I feel that black people in South Africa are disadvantaged in becoming freemasons. We are very disappointed in our coloured brothers for surrendering the charter for whatever reasons. Some of us would like to join freemasonry under PH for the same reasons of shared history and condition.

Where did you receive information that a charter was surrendered?


Sent from my iPhone using My Freemasonry Mobile
 

Mike Martin

Eternal Apprentice
Premium Member
Greetings once again. Pardon me for my lack of knowledge of the operations of the fraternity. I am a black south African and would like to join freemasonry so far I have knock on several doors of freemasons asking for assistance only to get silence respond. I find freemasonry to be structured as social club for few white elites who are not prepared to mix with lower middleclass specifically the black middle class. Missionaries were so desperate to get us into Christianity but to be a freemason. Someone told me I have to work up myself to a CEO of some institution to be a freemason. I thought freemasonry is an organisation of Enlighted beings who wanna share the light with the world.
So you're saying that you've contacted the Grand Lodge of South Africa ( www.grandlodge.co.za/ ) and completed its contact form ( www.grandlodge.co.za/join/) but you have not received any reply from it?

That seems a bit strange, what happened when you telephoned ( www.grandlodge.co.za/contact-us/) to find out about progress of your contact?
 
Top